Kyle the Idol judge

[Vote Quimby]

What an ass clown!

Just watched Today Tonight and this guys comes across as the biggest asshat.

Who the hell at Channel 10 thinks this guy is in any position to judge music? Having heard clips of Kyle's live in girlfriends song, from his label, it is absolute shite. He certainly can't judge talent if he thinks his girlfriend is good.

Guy has no problem ripping into young Idol wanna be's. But yet when someone questions him, he can't take it.

Good laughs for a tuesday night. And that's laughing at him, not with him.

[mrtimotae]

more of kyle being a tool:

http://www.bombshell.live.com.au/Frenzal_Fox_FM_Interview.mp3

[ieatkoala]

I have issues watching Austrailian Idol purely because I get embarrassed for everyone on the show.

Having Kyle there irks me to no end. I'd have no issues locking him in an abandoned fridge. My guess is that he was hired solely on the basis that he's an absolute prick - thus filling the ass groove in Dicko's chair.

I also dislike Dicko, however from a BMG honcho to puncey opinionated poon rash of a radio announcer - my bets on the first guy. XD

[chris_e_fresh]

kyle only picks the hot chicks that pass rego

[soulshine]

To many attention whores, just like big brother. The talented ones usually get overlooked

[Lord Belial]

What makes you think you need to have skill or talent to get on TV?

[navskore]

I heard an interview with him on the radio yesterday where he was claiming his gf was "crying all weekend" over the ads about it. Pfft die Kyle and your talentless gf too

[ozcar]

Talentless-done nothing twat.

I loved reading today that he used to be teased at school. Oh the irony now that he torments and lampoons young, fellow-talentless hacks.

Cockhead.

[Insigma]

Cant stand him, well cant stand the show either so yeh

[SoulWhiteMan]

I heard an interview with him on the radio yesterday where he was claiming his gf was "crying all weekend" over the ads about it. Pfft die Kyle and your talentless gf too

ads featuring clips of his behaviour, or something else????

Me, I think he's stealing our oxygen. For that he must die.

[Vote Quimby]

I heard an interview with him on the radio yesterday where he was claiming his gf was "crying all weekend" over the ads about it. Pfft die Kyle and your talentless gf too
They mentioned that in the story. Then cut to an interview she did where she said the bad press didn't bother her. She was just happy her name was being mentioned.

Cried all weekend. Riiiight.

[daveyjaye]

jus listened to that interview with the dude from frenzal rhomb

cant stand their music, but damn that guy is pretty smart n well spoken

completely fucked over kyle n jackie, n theres nothing better than arrogant ppl getting shat on...

made my night this has haha :D

[Oblivia]

more of kyle being a tool:

http://www.bombshell.live.com.au/Frenzal_Fox_FM_Interview.mp3

I like how he is on his high horse because Jay made Jackie cry, but he goes out and tries his best to make people cry.

I kinda found him entertaining at first but now I had enough.

[Oblivia]

^^oh, plus i loved how Jay was all inteligent and getting his point across and kyle and jackie o sounded like some spoiled ass school kids.

[taggs]

Yeah that Jay vs. Kyle & Jackie-O interview is hilarious, Jay shuts him down so many times.

Also, I hate how Kyle seems to think that people care about his opinions. He seems to think that people don't like him cause he "keeps it real". He's just a complete twat.

[antis]

yeah ive always though kylie was a dick but when i heard that interview i saw how fuct he really is

[rayza_kool]

man kyle is fuckin great!!!

he tells it like it is and doesnt mess around with the attention seeking little whores who couldnt sing a tune to say themselves but think they're the best thing since sliced bread.

its funny watchin the idiots who arent good (but think they are) walkin off after just been given a big slice of reality check :lol:

[SoulWhiteMan]

but, like tonight, he says that dumb sluts who can't sign, nor speak english properly, right yous, that they will get through because they're good looking and that's all it takes.
fuck off.

[Vote Quimby]

So what was he thinking when he produced his girlfriends song? It's shit and she's ugly.

[rancho]

you mean idol is on for another season?

bah, ill just stick to watching my classic tv show dvd collection.

[CheapThrills]

I remember when this interview happened. my god i laughed.

I watched about five minutes of Kyle drooling over a skank at least 10years younger than him and kick a desk over. WTF. I don't think Marcia likes him at all, poor girl having to sit next to it.

[rancho]

more of kyle being a tool:

http://www.bombshell.live.com.au/Frenzal_Fox_FM_Interview.mp3

:lol: pure gold.

OMG JACKIE WE'RE LOSING THIS ARGUMENT BADLY. LETS JUST TALK OVER HIM AND CUT HIM OFF, THEN CALL HIM A DICK ONCE WE'VE DISCONNECTED HIM. OMG WE ARE THE COOLEST RADIO HOSTS IN THE WORRRRRRRRLLLLLD!

[CheelWinston]

yep. those clowns got owned real, real hard right there.

[Darude]

Kyle is a wanker but hes entertaining so hes cool with me.

[Geezah]

Kyle is a wanker but hes entertaining so hes cool with me.
Agreed.

The pre-requisites for Idol are that you are either good looking or can hold a note, preferably both. Some of these clowns seriously reap what they sew.

And that Jay v Kyle clip is awesome. Has anyone got a picture of Kyle's girlfriend.

[romz]

what musical credit does kyle have?

hes a dum****!

[MadMike]

And that Jay v Kyle clip is awesome. Has anyone got a picture of Kyle's girlfriend.You might want to turn your speakers down.

http://www.tamarajaber.cjb.net/

[Xpose]

I think everyone has missed the biggest problem in the thread. Quimby watched TODAY TONIGHT, dude, what were you thinking?

[Davomaxi]

Sure Kyle sux but I really can't stomach Mark Holden anymore. He thinks he is so damn great - I would like to melt his face off and hear him scream himself to death quite frankly. Down with Holden.

[Faulks]

Kyle is a fucking idiot...
I watched some of it last night and that blond chick he wanted to go through wasnt even that good looking...

Kyle you are a stupid karnt in my opinion

[loopi]

The fact that kyle was judging girls with his d*ck is bloody retarded. We'll get some cheap skanky no-hoper idol who floats in and out of pitch while she stripteases.
What a shame.

[Xpose]

The fact that kyle was judging girls with his d*ck is bloody retarded. We'll get some cheap skanky no-hoper idol who floats in and out of pitch while she stripteases.
What a shame.
:-D i never thought of it that way !!!

[loopi]

trust you to find the positives in that situation Xpose :P

[Xpose]

trust you to find the positives in that situation Xpose :P
Auditions at my place. ;)

[Lady Lex]

I like him. He rocks.

Sounds like you all need a dose of self esteem. ;)

:)

And Quimby: you really want to place credibility in trash like Today Tonight?

[Xpose]

And Quimby: you really want to place credibility in trash like Today Tonight?
Finally somebody sees my point of view.

*hi lex long time no see :)

[Lilly Tei]

Sounds like you all need a dose of self esteem. ;)


Because they think someone is a tool that you don't?

[MadMike]

I think Kyle will erode some of the Idol demographic.

[Xpose]

Jay & The Doctor on the J's this morning are promoting "Jay's Girlfriend" as the next big thing then playing some god awful country track. Tis piss funny and none to subtle.

[Jazmine]

It seems his opinion is that Idol doesn't have to be about the singing anymore, which was always a big point in the past. I think he is going on the fact that while Casey Donovan won last year we haven't heard much of her since then... so he is going a different approach. He is going to end up woth a "Popstar" (damn now that was a COMPLETE waste of time hehehe-wait a minute-his gf came from there right?)
I have to say Mark annoys me more than anyone on TV possibly. What a rude bastard. Kyle is arrogant but Mark is just outright disrespectful-without even being slightly amusing. I have intense dislike for that man.

[Lady Lex]

Because they think someone is a tool that you don't?

nope.

Because many comments appear to stem from jealousy and insecurity.

Howz that?

btw: has no one ever wondered why they dont see the true motherfucker singers on it? Because people in the industry dont take it seriously. Its just a fun singing contest that happens to make a load of $$ for a record label.

[Gotti]

Kyle is a disgrace to Australia and more importantly the Australian music industry, i can only hope that he has incriminating video footage of someone at Aus idol and channel 10 headquarters and blackmailed his way through the door,

searching google for "kyle sanderlands" brings up some guys blog which i found slightly amusing.



Firstly, allow me to declare my complete and utter horror at the official announcement that infamous radio cock-bucket Kyle Sandilands (http://entertainment.news.com.au/story/0,10221,12308781-10229,00.html)is going to replace Dicko on Australian Idol. Executive producer for the show Stephen Tate has said “We left no stone unturned and looked internationally to find our new judge” so it boggles the mind that after a world-wide search, Kyle Fucking Sandilands is the best they could come up with. While I hope time proves me wrong, I am fearful that a demonic trio like Mark Holden, Marcia Hines and Mr Sandilands himself might be too much for my sensitive self to handle
BTW you're also a fuckwit

[Gotti]

nope.

Because many comments appear to stem from jealousy and insecurity.

Howz that?

jealousy and insecurity? maybe it's because the guy is such a stuck up cu*t that he thinks he can destroy quality australian music like frenzal.

[twistedbydesign]

lex please tell me what you like about this pile?

[Lady Lex]

For someone you all appear to hate so much, you all sure do care alot. :lol:

anyone been playing Playboy Mansion lately? :lol:

[twistedbydesign]

oh so we're all agreed he's an ass then?
cool

[Lady Lex]

lex please tell me what you like about this pile?

Prolly cos I piss myself with laughter everytime I listen to him. Who can take him so seriously that you have to hold such a profound emotion like hate against him?
I also admire him for his tenacity and determination. Not too long ago he was a homeless street kid. Gotta admire someone who grabs the world by its balls and twists it their way.

Gotti, my dear - so much angst for a sweety like yourself :)

[Goldfish]

as much as kyle is a d*ckhead, its australian idol, you audition, be prepared to get flamed... There are people auditioning who have absolutely no talent, but have been told their whole lives theyre wonderful, bout time someone told em the truth.... :thumb:

Hes an idiot and if he wants to get his talentless girlfriend on air then so be it, up to the listeners of his sh*tty radio program to complain.

[soulshine]

btw: has no one ever wondered why they dont see the true motherfucker singers on it? Because people in the industry dont take it seriously. Its just a fun singing contest that happens to make a load of $$ for a record label.

Yeah its great fun that the tallented people loose their livelyhood cause this talentless pile of shit is what passes for music these day and the youth are brainwashed into believing image is everything.

I need my coffee

[Lady Lex]

What makes Tamara talentless?

She's got a great voice. She plays a few instruments.

How is any of that talentless?

[soulshine]

Its pop, pop is shit

[bornslippy1984]

I accidentally turned Idol on last night, and I wanted to stab myself in the eyes and then rip my throat out.

I also admire him for his tenacity and determination. Not too long ago he was a homeless street kid. Gotta admire someone who grabs the world by its balls and twists it their way.

I admire him for the fact that his g/f is clearly going out with him because he offered her a record deal, and his 'record label' has only one artist on it (his g/f), and the fact that such a slovenly, idiotic, ****ish peice of shit has ever managed to get off the street.

Hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate.

[Lady Lex]

Yeah its great fun that the tallented people loose their livelyhood cause this talentless pile of shit is what passes for music these day and the youth are brainwashed into believing image is everything.

I need my coffee

Its the other way around actually! Cos who do the "Idol Finalists" need to back them for bands?

Professional musicians.

Its all good. I like the fact that Idol encourages people to listen to live music and hey - the odd mofo singer manages to be heard every now and then.

[MadMike]

What makes Tamara talentless?

She's got a great voice. She plays a few instruments.

How is any of that talentless?Umm Lex... --> http://www.tamarajaber.cjb.net/ (http://www.tamarajaber.cjb.net/)

[MadMike]

Ooh Aah I Lost My Bra

[bornslippy1984]

Ooh Aah I Lost My Bra

:lol:

[BumblingBee]

I also admire him for his tenacity and determination.

i personaly find it hard to admire someone that appears to be completely lacking in soul

i also cringe at the influence that he most probably has on our impressionable young teenagers (idols target market) - i'm sure that's exactly what our society needs - thousands of kyle wannabe's running around spouting mindless, offensive bullshit!

like there's not enough of that shit in the world already

on the flipside, i prey that commom sense will prevail and that kyles appointment as a judge will bring about a timely end to what is essentially a well marketed karaoke program, for semi-talented people without the gumption to have a crack at the music industry on their own merits

idol is made by losers, for losers :p

[bornslippy1984]

Its all good. I like the fact that Idol encourages people to listen to live music and hey - the odd mofo singer manages to be heard every now and then.

Idol encourages the idea that people have to sing in an R'n'B style to be 'talented singers'. Every person in the finals wavers their notes, and ends their songs with a long, drawn out wail that sound like I'm throwing a bag of cats down a flight of stairs. As you do.

I think that Chris Martin from Coldplay has a great voice. Hey, it's pop - but I don't hear him screeching and wavering his notes like a blinged up ghetto princess.

[bornslippy1984]

i personaly find it hard to admire someone that appears to be completely lacking in soul

i also cringe at the influence that he most probably has on our impressionable young teenagers (idols target market) - i'm sure that's exactly what our society needs - thousands of kyle wannabe's running around spouting mindless, offensive bullshit!

like there's not enough of that shit in the world already

on the flipside, i prey that commom sense will prevail and that kyles appointment as a judge will bring about a timely end to what is essentially a well marketed karaoke program, for semi-talented people without the gumption to have a crack at the music industry on their own merits

idol is made by losers, for losers :p

Seconded.

[Lady Lex]

I admire him for the fact that his g/f is clearly going out with him because he offered her a record deal, and his 'record label' has only one artist on it (his g/f), and the fact that such a slovenly, idiotic, ****ish peice of shit has ever managed to get off the street.

Hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate.

:lol:

I love your accurate research.

Consider a change in perspective for one moment:

Do any of you know much about the major record labels at all?

Then you know how they like to get their hands on talent (and hey - many a time, non-talent) and exploit the krap out of that talent until there aint a drop left to squeeze.
Along comes Kyle with his GF and with his connections, he can ensure none of these fuckers can 'hurt' her.

Besides, with the accessibility of Music Studios these days, anyone can be a 'popstar'.

A professional musician (some singers included) is a completely different story.
Reserve your admiration for them.

[lilsarah]

i love kyle.

[Chharge]

^^ its kyle and jack' o


:P

[dandharma]

btw, i think kyle sucks his girlfriends cock.

'Mr Music' beats the drum for his girlfriend

March 9, 2005

FOR an artist about to release her first solo single, Tamara Jaber is in an enviable position.
The former member of manufactured pop group Scandal'Us, which formed on reality TV show Popstars in 2001, is the girlfriend of 2Day FM and MTV host Kyle Sandilands.

Jaber is also the sole artist on Sandilands' record label King Kyle, which has just splurged $250,000 on a video clip for the singer's debut single Ooh Aah, which is due to hit shelves on March 28.

The song has been played on Sandilands' breakfast radio show, is the pick of the week on 2Day's Brisbane sister station B105 and was road-tested for the first time on competitor Nova 96.9 on Monday.

Nova asked listeners to SMS their opinions on the song, which drew a mixed response "which fell more towards the 'dislike' than the 'like'," a Nova spokeswoman told Confidential yesterday.

Austereo general manager Patrick Joyce told Confidential the song – based on a schoolyard rhyme, featuring the lyrics 'ooh, ahh, I lost my bra, I left it in my boyfriend's car' – is receiving "no special treatment" at the network.

King Kyle label manager Ryan Wellington told Confidential he believes Sandilands will use everything at his disposal to aid Jaber's career.

"If he can do her any favours in anything that he does, he would I suppose," he said.

"He's in a position where he's got his fingers in a lot of pies and they all sort of complement each other.

"He happens to host a radio program on 2Day, he's got a national radio program the Hot Hits, he's on MTV, he's the new Dicko on [Australian] Idol, he's Mr Music."

[LuvDatPoontang]

kyle as a person in general: POOPOO HEAD

kyle as an idol judge: AWESOME

im so confused :|

[bornslippy1984]

:Along comes Kyle with his GF and with his connections, he can ensure none of these fuckers can 'hurt' her.


I do know something about major record labels. Actually, quite possibly more than you do.

Let's get one thing straight: Kyle is a small fish. He acts like he has some sway in the music industry. He doesn't. It's as simple as that. The only thing that Kyle can do is guarantee a few plays on Austereo... and that's it. His connections are minimal, his power is non-existent, and the fact that you think that he is powerful ius more a testament to the power of PR than the power of Kyle.

More than one prominent industry member (ahem... no details on public forums) has called him a "snivelling peice of shit", and most agree. He is a blemish, a small spot on the face of the music industry that will be gone and forgotten in an instant.

[soulshine]

I remember my parents giving out to me about my taste in music. But at least the bands we (I) listened to had some originality. I stood by what I listened to. Music nowadays (dons old man hat) is a clone, just like fashion is one big clone, trucker hat pink shirt wearing clones. When I grew up there were rockers, Goths, break dancers, mods, skas, beatniks the list goes on. Nowadays its general pants or STFU. And its all down to pop star idols wannabe rubbish.

We should beat our kids and make them listen to Slayer and The Smiths until they hate life like we did. BASTARDS!
:P

[Lady Lex]

i personaly find it hard to admire someone that appears to be completely lacking in soul

i also cringe at the influence that he most probably has on our impressionable young teenagers (idols target market) - i'm sure that's exactly what our society needs - thousands of kyle wannabe's running around spouting mindless, offensive bullshit!


Society has always encouraged that sort of attitude anyway. There are already thousands of people who get away with that on a daily basis as 'normal people'. Doubt its gonna change because of one lone shock jockey.

And Mike: I always reserve my opinion on an artiste until Ive heard them live. Tamara has talent. She has a fine voice and can play guitar.
Whether or not I enjoy her music is another thing altogether.

[Gotti]

i'm sure that's exactly what our society needs - thousands of kyle wannabe's running around spouting mindless, offensive bullshit!

have been to a westfield shopping centre latley?
every kid these days is a *****.

[BumblingBee]

Society has always encouraged that sort of attitude anyway. There are already thousands of people who get away with that on a daily basis as 'normal people'. Doubt its gonna change because of one lone shock jockey.

true, but it doesn't mean that we should accept it, or encourage it further :meh:

[Goldfish]

I dont think Tamara has a fine voice at all, im not a singer like miss sexy lexie, but i am a musician, tamara's voice is very weak, yes she can hold a tune but there isnt any substance to her voice, but in the music thats all you need, good looks and an ok voice..

The pop industry has always searched for new talent based on looks, its nothing new, just that it happens to be splashed all over the tv now..

*blows kisses to miss lexie* miss you woman.

[BumblingBee]

have been to a westfield shopping centre latley?
every kid these days is a *****.

nah, kinda try and avoid shopping malls - imo they are even more soul-less than australian idol

doesn't suprise me though, i'm sure it's full of young ausmerican wankers

[Lady Lex]

I do know something about major record labels. Actually, quite possibly more than you do.

My experience has taught me: Dont assume anything about anyone traversing ITM.

Let's get one thing straight: Kyle is a small fish. He acts like he has some sway in the music industry. He doesn't. It's as simple as that. The only thing that Kyle can do is guarantee a few plays on Austereo... and that's it. His connections are minimal, his power is non-existent, and the fact that you think that he is powerful ius more a testament to the power of PR than the power of Kyle.

More than one prominent industry member (ahem... no details on public forums) has called him a "snivelling peice of shit", and most agree. He is a blemish, a small spot on the face of the music industry that will be gone and forgotten in an instant.

Where exactly have I stipulated he is powerful? I like him. he makes me laugh. I admire him for his achievements - espeically considering his background. Where in any of that have I expressed my so-called awe in his great powerfulness? :lol: You want power? Frontier is power.

Prominent Industry member? :lol: All those in the industry know if they want to create interest in their 'product', Kyle is one of the best people on the East Coast to generate that interesst. And anyone who has a serious dislike for Kyle enough to discount that he has no influence of any sort in any capacity are also those who are on their way DOWN....

And everyone knows how much Johnny Young hates Kyles ass :lol: ;)

[special ed]

this very thread proves that network 10's choice of kyle as a judge has done it's job.
they want a judge that causes controversy.
controversy gets people talking.
his social hierarchy in the music industry is toatlly irrelevant

[Lady Lex]

I dont think Tamara has a fine voice at all, im not a singer like miss sexy lexie, but i am a musician, tamara's voice is very weak, yes she can hold a tune but there isnt any substance to her voice, but in the music thats all you need, good looks and an ok voice..

The pop industry has always searched for new talent based on looks, its nothing new, just that it happens to be splashed all over the tv now..

*blows kisses to miss lexie* miss you woman.

Honey bunny: you like the music you like cos you like it ;) (and *mwah back) But I would rather invest my ears in Tamara than Tammin any day. (as an example - if one had to be forced into such unfortunate circumstances)

Thats what Pop Music is: Image Based and Image Driven.

[twistedbydesign]

Society has always encouraged that sort of attitude anyway. There are already thousands of people who get away with that on a daily basis as 'normal people'. Doubt its gonna change because of one lone shock jockey.

And Mike: I always reserve my opinion on an artiste until Ive heard them live. Tamara has talent. She has a fine voice and can play guitar.
Whether or not I enjoy her music is another thing altogether.alot of people can play guitar and sing with a fine voice lex.
there are thousands of more deserving talented individuals out there than the tripe that land contracts from this shit..

[Lady Lex]

Idol encourages the idea that people have to sing in an R'n'B style to be 'talented singers'. Every person in the finals wavers their notes, and ends their songs with a long, drawn out wail that sound like I'm throwing a bag of cats down a flight of stairs. As you do.

I think that Chris Martin from Coldplay has a great voice. Hey, it's pop - but I don't hear him screeching and wavering his notes like a blinged up ghetto princess.

:lol: Thats Mariah Careys 'fault' not Idol.

And that also goes to show the ignorance held by many punters (who audition that is)

[Lady Lex]

alot of people can play guitar and sing with a fine voice lex.
there are thousands of more deserving talented individuals out there than the tripe that land contracts from this shit..

Of course! Its a damn crime - look at Peter Cupples: one of the Australia's own icons and does anyone know who he is???

And do you think any of these people, were they to get the chance, have the intellectual property to
1) land a contract and
2) land a contract that ensures them creative control or at the least, doesnt serve their arse up the river?

Nup. Just because you 'deserve' to, never ever means you get to. Look at Miles Davis, Buddy Holden, Charlie Parker, Julian Addlerley, Wes Mongomery in fact pretty much any quality musician . Musician and Management are two different things. And its sucks arse. But you make do with the opportunities that come your way.

The thing about Talent: no one can take that away from you.

[bornslippy1984]

My experience has taught me: Dont assume anything about anyone traversing ITM.



Where exactly have I stipulated he is powerful? I like him. he makes me laugh. I admire him for his achievements - espeically considering his background. Where in any of that have I expressed my so-called awe in his great powerfulness? :lol: You want power? Frontier is power.

Prominent Industry member? :lol: All those in the industry know if they want to create interest in their 'product', Kyle is one of the best people on the East Coast to generate that interesst. And anyone who has a serious dislike for Kyle enough to discount that he has no influence of any sort in any capacity are also those who are on their way DOWN....

And everyone knows how much Johnny Young hates Kyles ass :lol: ;)

Not to mention Jason Whaley and the rest of Frenzal Rhomb. :lol:

Meh, suffice it so say that he can't protect his girlfriend, as his label is reliant on the support of Austereo. DMG ain't gonna give her any radio play, and if he's ever out of a job, so is she.


James "jimmy" Mathieson hates him as well, so I suppose there must be something good about him.

[bornslippy1984]

:lol: Thats Mariah Careys 'fault' not Idol.

And that also goes to show the ignorance held by many punters (who audition that is)

:lol:

True.

If I see another idiot singing a soul song wearing a Craid David style beanie and hoodie with cutoff sleeves, i'll slay something.

[Vote Quimby]

I think everyone has missed the biggest problem in the thread. Quimby watched TODAY TONIGHT, dude, what were you thinking?
It's the only comedy show on at 6:30. (I only have 5 channels)

[bornslippy1984]

It's the only comedy show on at 6:30. (I only have 5 channels)

Ray's hair is also good for a laugh.

[Vote Quimby]

Naomi Robson is much cuter than Ray. Plus ACA just rehashes all the same stories that Today Tonight has already done.

It's fun watching all these neighbour wars/ kids outta control/ family fued/ unwed mothers too lazy to work stories.

[SpaceMonkey]

Jay & The Doctor on the J's this morning are promoting "Jay's Girlfriend" as the next big thing then playing some god awful country track. Tis piss funny and none to subtle.

Lol, I was listening to the Js this morning and not having watched idol the whole thing was going straight over my head at the time but damn that's funny!! "Horse's Ass"!!!

[bornslippy1984]

It's fun watching all these neighbour wars/ kids outta control/ family fued/ unwed mothers too lazy to work stories.

May as well watch Neighbours.

[soulshine]

Ray's hair is also good for a laugh.

technically it's not really 'Rays' hair

[twistedbydesign]

Of course! Its a damn crime - look at Peter Cupples: one of the Australia's own icons and does anyone know who he is???

And do you think any of these people, were they to get the chance, have the intellectual property to
1) land a contract and
2) land a contract that ensures them creative control or at the least, doesnt serve their arse up the river?

Nup. Just because you 'deserve' to, never ever means you get to. Look at Miles Davis, Buddy Holden, Charlie Parker, Julian Addlerley, Wes Mongomery in fact pretty much any quality musician . Musician and Management are two different things. And its sucks arse. But you make do with the opportunities that come your way.

The thing about Talent: no one can take that away from you.
this is not my point
Shit like idol damages society.
why does the accessible have to be manufactured crap?
consumeristic quick buck shinanigans
shinanigans i say!

[bornslippy1984]

technically it's not really 'Rays' hair

:lol:

"oooh, look what I found in the props cupboard..."

[Lady Lex]

this is not my point
Shit like idol damages society.
why does the accessible have to be manufactured crap?
consumeristic quick buck shinanigans
shinanigans i say!

I can see your perspective. :)

Just curiously tho: do you work in the music industry in any form (other than being booked by venues for example)?

I believe that Idol has added toward generating the industry - and its more than a belief. Its seeing my friends actually get cushy gigs for once.

These 'idols' need musos to back them - good musos who know how to deal with people who have no clue about music.
The people behind Idol have to leave their usual gigs - which leaves it open for someone else (in the market: when a new gig comes along, that actually means TWO openings, not just one)
The corporate market has opened wider with more opportunities (so Corporate sucks - try sucking on the money you get from it instead).
The punters are 'educated' (to a degree) on what quality talent really is.
There is an upsurge of interest in live music.
Nationalist pride aswell. I love Guy - he has a briliant voice and to top it off: he really is a sweet guy ....

with no balls.. but hey - 2 outta 3 aint bad ;)

Pop Music has ALWAYS been manufactured drivel. Thanks to IBM, PCs the world over can now churn out even more musical shit. Thats what Pop Is and always has been and godforbid should anyone attempt to change it. It wont happen. stick to what you like is what I say.

Whatever options that punters chase after be it Idol, X Factor, - take it. You may think things like this does sweet krap all. But it doesnt - its just a bit more subtle.

[soulshine]

But it still manufactures shit music. And being the backing band to an idol is hardly something a musician would aspire to. They’re just doing it cause it’s the only way to make money. But if there wasn’t so much shit music out there, then the youth might be switched on to what this musician would like to do… create original music.

[twistedbydesign]

lex im not disputing that idol increases activity in the Aus music industry..but the medium they choose to use is a negative influence on society...

the inxs show illustrates my point perfectly...Hutchence would be turning in his grave

[bornslippy1984]

I love Guy - he has a briliant voice and to top it off: he really is a sweet guy ....


No person involved with Hillsong is sweet. It is the tool of the devil.

:|

Wait... scratch that.

Illustration of Hillsong:

WORSHIPPERS ->:bow::bow::bow::bow: :-* <- GUY SEBASTIAN SINGING NAUSEATINGLY BAD MUSIC

[Breakme]

I did dancing with Tamara when I was little and I heard that her mother forged some documents to get her into a performing arts high school and my mum thinks she has had a boob job.

[Lady Lex]

But it still manufactures shit music. And being the backing band to an idol is hardly something a musician would aspire to. They’re just doing it cause it’s the only way to make money. But if there wasn’t so much shit music out there, then the youth might be switched on to what this musician would like to do… create original music.

Where does history demonstrate that youth culture has ever been involved in 'good' creative original music?

When Miles released his quality original music in the 1950s, where were the people clammering for Kind of Blue? And then when Wes Montgomery DID achieve a following during the 1960s, he was branded a sellout. But where was the youth then too? And if you wanna hearken further: where were all the Salieri fans? or even the kudos for Webern?

Youre talking about a completely weird concept that music of today simple does not fall into.

It might be shit to you, but there are MANY people involved in the process. There are songwriters, producers, sound engineers, musicians, visual artists.. far too many to simply recall who have all wonderfully contributed in their way. You are only looking at the representing frontlining Image - as you would for Pop.

And Twisted: I guess I dont see it as negative. But then, there is so much negative shit in the industry anyway, another one aint gonna stand out too much. Pretty sad hey. Oh well.. s'long as you get to see some great musos and hear great music at the end of the day...

[twistedbydesign]

well i dont watch the show and haven't listened to nova etc in awhile so its not like its affecting me personally.
its a fair representation of our society as a whole though...everyone's chasing the green
no one's stoppin to listen for a second

[Xpose]

May as well watch Neighbours.
NO that would be "uncool"

:shifty eyes:

[Xpose]

No person involved with Hillsong is sweet. It is the tool of the devil.

:|

Wait... scratch that.

Illustration of Hillsong:

WORSHIPPERS ->:bow::bow::bow::bow: :-* <- GUY SEBASTIAN SINGING NAUSEATINGLY BAD MUSIC
I must disagree here he is a really nice guy like lex said. My girl does work for Camp Quality and the time he spends with those kids with cancer off his own back is realy commendable.

[Lady Lex]

No person involved with Hillsong is sweet. It is the tool of the devil.

:|

Wait... scratch that.

Illustration of Hillsong:

WORSHIPPERS ->:bow::bow::bow::bow: :-* <- GUY SEBASTIAN SINGING NAUSEATINGLY BAD MUSIC

sure.

But I aint gonna discount his talent dude. He's a mighty fine singer. Again - whether or not I like his music is indeed another issue.

And twisted: Id say youve hit it on the head with that comment. :)

[soulshine]

The youth culture was a lot more in tune before. You are dwelling on a few negatives. I can only refer to the music when I was growing up. Sure there was a lot of shit in the charts in the 80’s early 90’s, but there was also a lot of quality in there too, New order, Joy Davison, Smiths, Cure, GnR, Pixies, Nirvana, Culture club (just kidding) and watching top of the pop wasn’t the painfully mind numbing product placement “oh baby I miss you, darling why’d you leave me..huh” shite that is saturated in today’s charts. I’d watch the chart shows cause I knew that some of the alternative acts would be shown amongst the shite. Now its 99% shite. Or maybe I’m just too old. I dunno.

RnB, rap, and crappy boy band angst drivel is what teenagers think is music. There is no ‘alternative’ anymore,and that is the fault of the greedy record companies. They cannot exploit the alternative musicians cause they wouldn’t sell there souls, so they exploit the pretty, safe, tv friendly sellout pop bands. IMO

Just read over my post and I sound like my dad. :lol:

[BumblingBee]

Pop Music has ALWAYS been manufactured drivel.

bullshit!

ever heard of a band called the beatles :p

[Xpose]

sure.

But I aint gonna discount his talent dude. He's a mighty fine singer. Again - whether or not I like his music is indeed another issue.

And twisted: Id say youve hit it on the head with that comment. :)
I agree having heard both albums as Mrs X is a fan, with the right production he could move big units in the US. Seriously.

He has the vocal talent equal to say a Juzzy Timberlake all he is missing is Jus Blaze, Timbabland or the Neptunes and he would blow big.

Again i am far from a fan but boy got talent.

[Gotti]

RnB, rap, and crappy boy band angst drivel is what teenagers think is music. There is no ‘alternative’ anymore,and that is the fault of the greedy record companies. They cannot exploit the alternative musicians cause they wouldn’t sell there souls, so they exploit the pretty, safe, tv friendly sellout pop bands. IMO

Just read over my post and I sound like my dad. :lol:
:bow: nail on the head

[Xpose]

RnB, rap, and crappy boy band angst drivel is what teenagers think is music. There is no ‘alternative’ anymore,and that is the fault of the greedy record companies. They cannot exploit the alternative musicians cause they wouldn’t sell there souls, so they exploit the pretty, safe, tv friendly sellout pop bands. IMO

Just read over my post and I sound like my dad. :lol:
Please dont take what is in the charts and call it "rap". Rap music is an unbelivably creative and diverse genre filled with brilliant release after brilliant release, IF you know where to look.

[twistedbydesign]

this is our point x
people think that is rap because of shit like idol

[bornslippy1984]

Xpose my niggwa, Lex - I was taking the piss. I'm sure he is a lovely guy who has a hell of a better chance of getting into heaven than I do.

There was some... unpleasantness, I can never go there.

*note: Simpsons quote edited for relevance. None of this "Dude, you didnt put in a semicolon/I'm more accurate than you" from you geeks. :p

[Xpose]

this is our point x
people think that is rap because of shit like idol
Oh it pains me no end the publics perception of hip ho pas a culture and rap as a style of music. I hate the fact that NZ hip hop that is 2nd rate US rip offs accents and all can sell in this country yet all of our brilliant local artists have to work day jobs to eat.

However i dont blame it on idol, there has always been, Young MC, Coolio, Will Smith, Ja Rule, Jay Z, MC Hammer etc etc the commercial side will always be around.

[BumblingBee]

It might be shit to you, but there are MANY people involved in the process. There are songwriters, producers, sound engineers, musicians, visual artists.. ...

and the best that all these people can produce is nollsy's cover of what about me!

there may be a lot of talented people working behind the scenes, but look at the end results - i am yet to hear a song associated with aus idol that has actually moved me in anyway

there is no soul in idol, just sellouts not being true to themselves (IMO)

[Xpose]

and the best that all these people can produce is nollsy's cover of what about me!

there may be a lot of talented people working behind the scenes, but look at the end results - i am yet to hear a song associated with aus idol that has actually moved me in anyway

there is no soul in idol, just sellouts not being true to themselves (IMO)
I cant believe i'm going to defend Guy Sebastian on a public board BUT he is a talented artist being what he wants to be.

As far as inoffensive uptempo pop music goes his second album is as listenable as anything.

He also wrote a fair portion of it and gone are the awful covers and stage songs with there big notes.

I'm sure he isnt a frustrated death metal artist waiting to get out and that pop is exactly what he wants to do.

[twistedbydesign]

true, hip hop culture in the publics eyes has always been about the bling..and as far as the public knows this is what it truly is.

the money makers tell us what to like
this is what kids are exposed to growing up
this is what they know as music
some see the light earlier than others but some dont see it at all.
idol and the like accelerate the consumerism process dramatically..

[Gotti]

true, hip hop culture in the publics eyes has always been about the bling..and as far as the public knows this is what it truly is.

your confusing American and Australian hip hop

[Xpose]

the money makers tell us what to like
this is what kids are exposed to growing up
this is what they know as music
some see the light earlier than others but some dont see it at all.
idol and the like accelerate the consumerism process dramatically..
Musically i still believe we as a country ride firmly on the US's nutsack. There idol has laregly been free of RnB and wannabe rap success stories.

Yes two winners have been RnB artists but fuck me both Ruben Studdard and Fantasia are both brilliant singers who deserved record deals.

What i'm getting at is the push of generic urban rubbishh is fairly and squarely riding on the back of the US charts - Chingy, Nelly, Generic Girl group of the week have all become huge in the states and the fact our record company execs are quite clueless and lazy means this shit gets forced on the Australian public.

Any 12 year old will like something that is catchy and all over radio and TV, regardless of wether they are an idol star or not.

[twistedbydesign]

the public doesnt know there is such a thing as aussie hip hop

[Xpose]

the public doesnt know there is such a thing as aussie hip hop
What about that lovely genie from the tim tams add and his group. Oooh and the chubby faced boy with the funny voices from the drumsticks add.

:rollseyes: :sigh:

[Davomaxi]

I think everyone's being too harsh on 'Ooh Ahh I lost my Bra'. I like it :love:

[Goldfish]

:lol: gotta love how an attack on an australian idol judge has turned into a debate on the merits of such a show. The original argument was that Kyle should not be insulting young girls at a time when they are likely to take such comments seriously.
As for the music debate, manufactured pop has always and will always be around, if you dont like it dont listen, dont buy it, support those whose music you do love.

[Gotti]

the public doesnt know there is such a thing as aussie hip hop
and thats one of the problems, there is massive talent in aussie hiphop

downside, hilltop hoods, koolism to name afew

[I am the best]

What about that stoner from the last season that had the big clock around his neck and got to record on the 'rejects' album??

He was a star


(email may contain sarcasm and traces of peanuts)

[maxomillion]

bullshit!

ever heard of a band called the beatles :p
I was just thinking that, only recently has pop taken a dive, and IMO its a direct result of idol etc.

[twistedbydesign]

What about that lovely genie from the tim tams add and his group. Oooh and the chubby faced boy with the funny voices from the drumsticks add.

:rollseyes: :sigh:
do you think people recognize Nfamas as a lyricist?
fuck no man
he is the tim tam genie in their eyes
the hip hop that the public is fed is monotone bling..

why are you rolling your eyes man?

[Xpose]

I was just thinking that, only recently has pop taken a dive, and IMO its a direct result of idol etc.
Westlife, Fi5e, Backstreet Boys, NSync, Kylie Minogue, E17, New Kids On The Block, The Spice Girls, should i continue?

[DJ Fusion]

A dance music forum trying to comment on the quality of the music industry...

:lol:

[Xpose]

do you think people recognize Nfamas as a lyricist?
fuck no man
he is the tim tam genie in their eyes
the hip hop that the public is fed is monotone bling..

why are you rolling your eyes man?
To indicate the sarcasm in my post Mr twisted. I realise that is all they know him as, also he is far from a lyricist if he rhymes I'm Blazing like Ned Kelly once more i may rip out his vocal chords.

[maxomillion]

ha ha yeah true, but theres still plenty of top notch pop out there.

[Xpose]

and thats one of the problems, there is massive talent in aussie hiphop

downside, hilltop hoods, koolism to name afew
Without a doubt one of the most progressive scenes in the world as is the UK scene.

That said there is still brilliant stuff out of the US, this year alone Edan - Beauty and the Beat, OC - Starchild, Common - Be are as good as you could hope to hear.

[twistedbydesign]

and thats one of the problems, there is massive talent in aussie hiphop

downside, hilltop hoods, koolism to name afew
i am well aware brother
i saw downsyde play on saturday
i spin more aussie stuff than anythin else

[dj amr]

I think everyone's being too harsh on 'Ooh Ahh I lost my Bra'. I like it :love:

you obviously havent seen 13 year olds down the shopping centre doing their dance display which contains "sexually suggestive" dance moves. 13 year olds. I saw the looks on the parents faces, i saw the way creepy guys were watching, i saw the people laughing at them. It was very wrong and i felt sorry for them. I was very angry that the dance instructor allowed girls to display themselves so cheaply, to a cheap song.

[Xpose]

you obviously havent seen 13 year olds down the shopping centre doing their dance display which contains "sexually suggestive" dance moves. 13 year olds. I saw the looks on the parents faces, i saw the way creepy guys were watching, i saw the people laughing at them. It was very wrong and i felt sorry for them. I was very angry that the dance instructor allowed girls to display themselves so cheaply, to a cheap song.
<political correctness off>

Oh well if they are old enough to crawl they are in the right position.

</political correctness off>

[twistedbydesign]

To indicate the sarcasm in my post Mr twisted. I realise that is all they know him as, also he is far from a lyricist if he rhymes I'm Blazing like Ned Kelly once more i may rip out his vocal chords.ah i see
itm damages the sarcasm reader

[dj amr]

and thats one of the problems, there is massive talent in aussie hiphop

downside, hilltop hoods, koolism to name afew

too true as well twisted & Gotti. FBI had the stolen records show and for some reason i was always in my car at the time - and i reckon that was some of the best shit i've heard in any Aussie music genre for sure. i even went and bought the compilation, its not the best but theres some fantastic music on there, and the freestyles are not only amazing but humerous too!

[Lady Lex]

But it still manufactures shit music. And being the backing band to an idol is hardly something a musician would aspire to. They’re just doing it cause it’s the only way to make money. But if there wasn’t so much shit music out there, then the youth might be switched on to what this musician would like to do… create original music.

i hadnt read this properly before.

No. Being a backing band to an Oz Idol isnt a musician's aspiration.

But playing with motherfucker musicians IS.

And where the hell did you get the idea that theyre there to make money? You enter into the career of a musician, you cant ever expect to make money. Getting paid is a bonus. Whereever you got that misguided opinion is just wrong.

If someone offers a muso a gig (and usually, people want the BEST musos, not the cheapest), that muso us gonna take it. Because every musician is a gigwhore. For example: Ric Goldmeister was offered the drum seat for Idol and as the best drummer on the East Coast, anyone knows that if theyve got Ric on drums, theyve got every hella muso aswell. thats the way it works. And theres nothing wrong with wanting to play with mofo musos. Its a lifelong trip to perform alongside mofo musicians.

[twistedbydesign]

shantan cracks me up man

[Xpose]

too true as well twisted & Gotti. FBI had the stolen records show and for some reason i was always in my car at the time - and i reckon that was some of the best shit i've heard in any Aussie music genre for sure. i even went and bought the compilation, its not the best but theres some fantastic music on there, and the freestyles are not only amazing but humerous too!
ology is one of the most knowlegable hip hop fans around.

[Lady Lex]

ha ha yeah true, but theres still plenty of top notch pop out there.

Well Bumbling Bee might be happy to discount this, but the good pop (blurgh) is a result of the people BEHIND the 'image' - the songwriters, producers, sound engineers.. etc The music industry, krapola as it is, DOES employ those who are very good in their field. The best end up in LA (thinks of Tim who wrote the Humphrey B Bear tune...)

And I think many will also find that Aussie HipHop is quite alive.. when you have such acts as Cleptophonics happening.. its impossible to think Aussie HipHop just aint there. its just underground Frank Zappa says Mainstream comes to you, but you have to go underground.

[Xpose]

And I think many will also find that Aussie HipHop is quite alive.. when you have such acts as Cleptophonics happening.. its impossible to think Aussie HipHop just aint there. its just underground Frank Zappa says Mainstream comes to you, but you have to go underground.
Ozhip hop is an vibrant as it has ever been, each release seems to raise the quality bar, however like quality US and UK hip hop it will never chart well.

In related idol news from todays Advertiser newspaper

"Casey Donovan set a new record for lowest debut for a idol single, the single shipped 550 copies and has not been added to many commercial playlists"

[Lady Lex]

you obviously havent seen 13 year olds down the shopping centre doing their dance display which contains "sexually suggestive" dance moves. 13 year olds. I saw the looks on the parents faces, i saw the way creepy guys were watching, i saw the people laughing at them. It was very wrong and i felt sorry for them. I was very angry that the dance instructor allowed girls to display themselves so cheaply, to a cheap song.

Dancing has ALWAYS been seen as lewd and sexually explicit. My god.. you should read the articles from the 1960s that shoot down (now harmless) The Twist!

Whilst men have dicks, they will ALWAYS be able to insert some sort of sexual slant on anything.

[Goldfish]

Ozhip hop is an vibrant as it has ever been, each release seems to raise the quality bar, however like quality US and UK hip hop it will never chart well.

In related idol news from todays Advertiser newspaper

"Casey Donovan set a new record for lowest debut for a idol single, the single shipped 550 copies and has not been added to many commercial playlists"

id actually prefer aussie hip hop stayed off the commercial charts a bit, i dont want to listen to every 12 year from the western suburbs thinking they have any idea.

[Xpose]

id actually prefer aussie hip hop stayed off the commercial charts a bit, i dont want to listen to every 12 year from the western suburbs thinking they have any idea.
cute and smart ;)

[soulshine]

i hadnt read this properly before.

No. Being a backing band to an Oz Idol isnt a musician's aspiration.

But playing with motherfucker musicians IS.

And where the hell did you get the idea that theyre there to make money? You enter into the career of a musician, you cant ever expect to make money. Getting paid is a bonus. Whereever you got that misguided opinion is just wrong.

If someone offers a muso a gig (and usually, people want the BEST musos, not the cheapest), that muso us gonna take it. Because every musician is a gigwhore. For example: Ric Goldmeister was offered the drum seat for Idol and as the best drummer on the East Coast, anyone knows that if theyve got Ric on drums, theyve got every hella muso aswell. thats the way it works. And theres nothing wrong with wanting to play with mofo musos. Its a lifelong trip to perform alongside mofo musicians.

Your completely missing my point. It’s the only paying forum where these people get to jam together. I'm sure they'd rather be out jamming together in a festival full of fellow music (in the true sense) lovers, than performing in the dark behind some wannabe popstar.

My point is that its a pity they have to perform under this shitty corporate eye, regurgitating old classic when they could be performing their own original music.

And I have no idea who Ric Goldmeister is, but i unfortunately know who Guy Sebastian and all the other 'idols' are. Which enforces my point even more.

[dj amr]

Dancing has ALWAYS been seen as lewd and sexually explicit. My god.. you should read the articles from the 1960s that shoot down (now harmless) The Twist!

Whilst men have dicks, they will ALWAYS be able to insert some sort of sexual slant on anything.

sorry Lex, i probably should have mentioned it was Physical Culture. If you know what that is, then you should know its not like the dancing we all assume when we say dancing and sexually suggestive moves dont belong in physical culture. this was part of their "dance routine" which is still built on the fundamentals of physie.


yeah that Kyle guy sucks hey? what a man-bitch

[Lady Lex]

YOU still dont get it either soulshine.

Musos want to play with other mofo musicians. I turn down big money gigs all the time in favour of the opp to play jazz with some mofo. It has nothing to do with your silly opinion that musos play only for money. And everything to do with the vibe that is on the stage. Regardless of festivals or whatever How many festivals in Oz can a muso depend upon? VERY FEW. You take whatever opps come your way and you make the most of them.

And even though YOU dont know who Ric Goldmeister is, every pro musician in Australia DOES, and therefore he is the biggest drawcard for why pro musos are happy to play in Australian Idol. And it reinforces my opinion that all punters have no clue about what goes on in the industry. Because all they WANT to do is focus on the frontlining image. Did it ever occur to you to even consider the musicians who do play on the stage for all the idols? Once? No? But just because you dont think about it doesnt make it any less worthy.

Original music has its place. Nothing wrong with classics either - hence them being classics.

[maxomillion]

Well Bumbling Bee might be happy to discount this, but the good pop (blurgh) is a result of the people BEHIND the 'image' - the songwriters, producers, sound engineers.. etc The music industry, krapola as it is, DOES employ those who are very good in their field. The best end up in LA (thinks of Tim who wrote the Humphrey B Bear tune...)

What is pop? I thought it was simply popular music.
I'd consider the dandy warhols last album 'welcome to the monkey house' pop rock. It was good till fuckn restataurant rules flogged it.

[I am the best]

its 'skip hop'

[Xpose]

its 'skip hop'
Uneducated opinion noted.

[soulshine]

Lady Lex, Hey it’d be awesome if you could drop the condescending tone, it’s just a friendly discussion. :)

And you seem to be dodging my point. But that’s all good. Its nice to get an incite in the industry, you being in it and all.

You make a point that these musicians have a great time at these idol gigs playing with each other and being awesome and all that, and that’s great, but what good is it for them in the long run when I don’t even know who they are, I only leave knowing the singer, who might be talented but his career is mapped out for him and will no doubt end up producing radio friendly yawn pop.

I love discovering new good music, idol is not that. I’m all for idol as a bit of TV entertainment, but come on. How many of these pop stars do we need clogging up the airwaves and charts aswell. I wanna see more Ric Goldmeisters in the charts. That’s the point/question I’m asking. Give good musicians a chance to BE CREATIVE :)

[I am the best]

Uneducated opinion noted.


sorry i forgot to write

<uneducated opinion on>

<uneducated opinion off>


;)

[BumblingBee]

My point is that its a pity they have to perform under this shitty corporate eye, regurgitating old classic when they could be performing their own original music.


it is a great pity

but that's progress

and the power of the almighty - tv!

oh how i yearn for the good old days, when the music industry was about blood, sweat and tears - music was (IMO) a lot more honest & spontaneous

idol is nothing moe than a marketing exercise

kyle is just a pawn in this whole sham

i will never be able to accept that the positives of idol (as defended so vehemently by ladylex) outweigh the negatives

but like i said in one of my earlier posts - i like my music to have at least a bit of soul

[Xpose]

sorry i forgot to write

<uneducated opinion on>

<uneducated opinion off>


;)
I lolled in real life at that :thumb:

[bornslippy1984]

I think that the singles chart in every country should note the composer of the song. Think about it - not only would it give credit where it is deserved, but it would also highlight which artists have made their own, original music - and which are just relying on good writers/composers, or those who are just remixing old songs and churning out bad covers *cough*STARSKEEANTHONYCALLEADON'SFT.TECHNOTRONIC*c ough*

[Lady Lex]

Lady Lex, Hey it’d be awesome if you could drop the condescending tone, it’s just a friendly discussion. :)

And you seem to be dodging my point. But that’s all good. Its nice to get an incite in the industry, you being in it and all.

You make a point that these musicians have a great time at these idol gigs playing with each other and being awesome and all that, and that’s great, but what good is it for them in the long run when I don’t even know who they are, I only leave knowing the singer, who might be talented but his career is mapped out for him and will no doubt end up producing radio friendly yawn pop.

I love discovering new good music, idol is not that. I’m all for idol as a bit of TV entertainment, but come on. How many of these pop stars do we need clogging up the airwaves and charts aswell. I wanna see more Ric Goldmeisters in the charts. That’s the point/question I’m asking. Give good musicians a chance to BE CREATIVE :)

First: Im really sorry if Im coming across as condescending - cos I aint. Im passionate about it. So sorry.

Its not sad dude! Not when you get to play with Ric Goldmeister or Anthny Dawkins, or ANY of the really amazing musos who DO want to play. I know its weird..

And yes whilst I understand the good side of Originals.. people (in Oz) as a whole do not want to listen to original music. They like to listen to stuff that they already know. Completely different in Japan - you get up and belt out an obvious western tune: you have an appreciative crowd in no time.

But hey - you can change that trend.. merely by acknowledging the musicians in the background at all time.. because when you recognise them, you end up seeing what they do - and the projects they become involved in. For example: Ric has played with some amazing US jazz dudes and in fact, has encouraged the US interests in Oz. little changes in perspective enhances the industry in the most subtle but definite ways. And hey - we might even get an education out of it all :)

[Xpose]

Lex did Branford Marsailes come to Brisbane this month? Speaking of amazing musicians.

[Lady Lex]

yeh! He is mofo! But.. I like his brother Wynton better.
Im not too.. hyped about the Brandford gig - I hate clarinet and I hate Sydney Orchestra. *teehee Elitist.

[Goldfish]

oi watch it lexie :P

[Lady Lex]

Such an elitist.

[Lady Lex]

And back on track: Kyle is kewl.

He's jsut a human like you, me and anyone else in this world.

[Xpose]

And back on track: Kyle is kewl.

He's jsut a human like you, me and anyone else in this world.
:-D you're are human??? I am a cyborg.

[BumblingBee]

And yes whilst I understand the good side of Originals...

as a musician, the satisfaction that comes from playing your own material to an appreciative crowd, is far greater than it will ever be if you are just playing covers

there is no comparison

original music is where it is at

music is about creativity, heart and passion

being a session muso isn't (imo)

a session muso is about $$ and having a good technique

not saying there is anything wrong with people making money from this form of playing music - i just hope that the people that are (making money) playing other's songs, use some of this money to explore their own creativity instead of somebody elses :)

as for kyle being 'kewl' - you're dreaming :p

edit typo

[Goldfish]

s'if youre human lexie :P

[DJ Fusion]

Lol, 4 pages of tall poppy syndrome = best thread ever.

[Lady Lex]

as a musician, the satisfaction that comes from playing your own material to an appreciative crowd, is far greater than it will ever be if you are just playing covers

there is no comparison

original music is where it is at

music is about creativity, heart and passion

being a session muso isn't (imo)

a session muso is about $$ and having a good technique

not saying there is anything wrong with people making money from this form of playing music - i just hope that the people that are (making money) playing other's songs, use some of this money to explore their own creativity instead of somebody elses :)

as for kyle being 'kewl' - you're dreaming :p

edit typo

Musos have different motivations. The satisfaction actually comes moreso from knowing your instrument inside out and being able come together with other musicians and playing the krap out of whatever you like.

I dont agree about your theory on session musicians at all. Session musicians are the cream of all musicians. They deserve the honour and the $$ that comes with session musicians. They also generate the entire industry.

And yes there is plenty of comparison Im afraid. Who do you think inspires originals? You think originals come from the air? Its inspired by previous tunes and genres. No way to avoid it.

[Xpose]

Lol, 4 pages of tall poppy syndrome = best thread ever.
Tall poppy chopping stopped a couple of pages back didn't it.

[Lady Lex]

Lol, 4 pages of tall poppy syndrome = best thread ever.
:lol:

you got it in one :)

[BumblingBee]

Session musicians are the cream of all musicians. They deserve the honour and the $$ that comes with session musicians. They also generate the entire industry.

technical proficiency - yes

genuine inspirational talent - not neccesarily

so we'll have to agree to disagree on that

i'd also like to know what you mean when you state that they generate the whole industry

(imo and once again this whole issue is a matter of opinion) if they were the 'cream' they would be doing their own thing - playing their own music

why do they become session muso's

is it because they don't have the imagination to do their own thing?

or is it because they lack the courage to back themselves and their talent by going it alone

or is it for the $$'s so that they can fund their own true musical journey

maybe they become session muso's because they don't have the dedication and commitment required to make it on their own

anyway, like i said, perhaps it's best that we agree to disagree :)

[maxomillion]

Lol, 4 pages of tall poppy syndrome = best thread ever.Sif he's a tall poppy,
idol judge ain't no acheivement :lol:

[Lady Lex]

technical proficiency - yes

genuine inspirational talent - not neccesarily

so we'll have to agree to disagree on that

i'd also like to know what you mean when you state that they generate the whole industry

(imo and once again this whole issue is a matter of opinion) if they were the 'cream' they would be doing their own thing - playing their own music

why do they become session muso's

is it because they don't have the imagination to do their own thing?

or is it because they lack the courage to back themselves and their talent by going it alone

or is it for the $$'s so that they can fund their own true musical journey

maybe they become session muso's because they don't have the dedication and commitment required to make it on their own

anyway, like i said, perhaps it's best that we agree to disagree :)

Upon what are you basing your theories?

How do you know that session musos ARENT doing their own original music? all the session musos I know DO and play in their own original bands too. They are coveted musicians - because they are the best. Everyone wants sessions musos to play with them. The recent releases of pop stars into the market have been session musos for bloody years. The Chick who sings "So Hot Right Now" has been a session muso for 8 years at least. And I say they generate the industry because THEY DO. New musos are taught by these guys instilling their musical values and ensuring it 'lives on'. They inspire. Also: Whenever a gig comes up for them (like a session or headlining with a major act eg Dave Weckl) that leaves a place for someone else to fill. And session musicians are ASKED to become session musos - its not musicians seeking for the position. It makes being a full time muso a lil but easier.

I didnt say Technical Proficiency - because there is far more to knowing your instruments inside and out then mere technicalities. Theres expressionism.. all the abstract stuff that comes from knowing your craft inside and out.

And you are not disagreeing with me from knowledge. You are disagreeing with me from ignorance. For chrissakes.. dont judge the time and effort a musician has bloody well put into their craft - regardless of where they play or who for. Theyre talent ffs. Attitudes like yours really annoy the krap outta me - but its indicative of Australia on the whole. :(

[Oblivia]

ugh, if he was just choosing hot chicks it would be fine, but he has shit as taste, he goes for nasty skanky types and is all 'oh yeah, you have sex appeal i will say yes. 1 the chicks he likes only appeal to the nasty cheap trashy lovin market, and 2 sure looks should be a factor, but only a factor, singing ability would help.

[Geezah]

You might want to turn your speakers down.

http://www.tamarajaber.cjb.net/ (http://www.tamarajaber.cjb.net/)

Thanks for the link and the heads up about the speakers dude. God, that is terrible. Why? Why? Why? Why are there so many people who can't just realise that they are very talented karaoke performers and be happy with that? Do the grind 9 to 5 like everyone else and be the killer MC at karaoke.

[Geezah]

They inspire
This the one thing I can plausibly disagree with you on in this context LadyLex. Really, session musos are not the inspiration for most people to learn an instrument. That is a fallacy. I really can't beleive you are saying that in any real seriousness.

N.B. I realise I have taken one very minor point out of a plethora, hence the reference to plausibility at the start.

[rancho]

youre also all forgetting that the show is supposed to be filled with controvers and emotions etc. its what keeps the masses watching! some people love to see people getting written off, so they watch. some people hate seeing people getting written off so they watch it anyway. etc etc.

imagine if australian idle was as follows

audition 1. good singer
judge 1. that was good sweetheart.
judge 2. yes, that was good.
judge 3. it was ok.
see you in the finals.
walk off stage
audition 2. bad singer
judge 1. sorry honey that wasnt very good but thanks for trying
judge 2. yes i agree, that wasnt very impressive, but keep practicing and come back next year.
judge 3. it wasnt the worst ive heard but you definitely need some lessons.
walk off stage.

bor-fucking-ing.

[twistedbydesign]

And yes whilst I understand the good side of Originals.. people (in Oz) as a whole do not want to listen to original music. They like to listen to stuff that they already know.


when you say people as a whole are you talking about the general majority idol is aimed at?

they know these songs because musos wrote them
i dont agree at all

[soulshine]

watched it last night for shits and giggles and i have to say, althought he is a cock, Kyle is entertaining to watch.
But he is still a insulting redneck asshole, and just cause he used to be homeless, it doesnt give him the right to act that way.

[Gotti]

speaking of this homeless excuse does anyone have a link

[Lady Lex]

when you say people as a whole are you talking about the general majority idol is aimed at?

they know these songs because musos wrote them
i dont agree at all

No. Im saying about Australia in general.

And further to Bumbling Bee's comments that Original Music is where its at: heres a case in point.

Jeff, the drummer from george, has not had a gig in almost 2 years. Because he is signed to geroge who are signed to a label, he can not do any session work. He basically is reduced to supporting his family by 3 options:
* the dole
* corporate/clubs circuit
* teaching.

Now, unfortunately, while he was out doing the hard yards and playing original music, he doesnt have the qualifications/papers to teach at the level he SHOULD be teaching (tertiary level). Its just great.. all the years he's put into george. He has a family to support. How does he cope? but of course Original Music is where it is at A guy has gotta live. Original Music is NOT where it is at. It is where the heart would like to be, but the mind has to search elsewhere in order to survive.

And Geezah: Session musicians DO inspire. You just gotta get any drummer in to see Steve Francis (for example) play on his kit: you suddenly have these drummers even more determined to keep at it. As I pointed out before: musicians dont aspire to be session musicians - they are invited.

And Kyle is still kewl. Ive noticed Ms Hines aint quite the 'sweety' she usually is. Bless them both.

[Lady Lex]

watched it last night for shits and giggles and i have to say, althought he is a cock, Kyle is entertaining to watch.
But he is still a insulting redneck asshole, and just cause he used to be homeless, it doesnt give him the right to act that way.

When does Kyle ever bring that up as an excuse?

I know from experience when youve fought really hard at merely living, you just dont care what people think about you. You take what youve been offered and make the best of it. And Kyle has done marvellously.

I think that is people's general 'problem'. Caring too much about what other people think of them rather than just focussing on what has to be done. But hey..

[soulshine]

When does Kyle ever bring that up as an excuse?..

you brought it up actually

I think that is people's general 'problem'. Caring too much about what other people think of them rather than just focussing on what has to be done. But hey ?..
It’s called common courtesy, or manners or respect. Take your pick.

What an awesome world it would be if everyone spoke their minds and let people know what they were really thinking :|

[BumblingBee]

Upon what are you basing your theories?

How do you know that session musos ARENT doing their own original music?


Everyone wants sessions musos to play with them.

New musos are taught by these guys instilling their musical values and ensuring it 'lives on'.

They inspire.

And session musicians are ASKED to become session musos - its not musicians seeking for the position.

And you are not disagreeing with me from knowledge. You are disagreeing with me from ignorance.

For chrissakes.. dont judge the time and effort a musician has bloody well put into their craft - regardless of where they play or who for.

Attitudes like yours really annoy the krap outta me - but its indicative of Australia on the whole. :(

ok, i wasn't going to respond, because you obviously have very rigid opinions about this, so much so, that it appears as if you took my opinions personally & were blinded as to the point i was trying to make - so what's the point with arogant people like yourself that think they 'know it all'

my theories as you like to call them, are nothing more than a personal observation and opinion (as i went out of my way to try and emphasise in my original posts)

i don't know that session muso's arent doing their own thing, infact i presume that a large number probably do - the point i was trying to make is that imo if a muso is exclusively doing session work, i believe that they are to some extent not being true to themselves JUST MY OPINION

everyone want session muso's to play with them? that is your opinion and definitely not a fact - so don't claim it as such

new muso's can also be self taught and a lot of them seek a broad range of influences in the development of their musical values - they also inspire themselves and benefit in the area of originality - it still 'lives on' - inspiration can come from absolutely anywhere

they inspire, maybe but so do a hell of a lot of other things when it comes to making music

not all session musicians are merely asked to do the job - some of them are nothing more than guns for hire - musical whores

you claim that i am ignorant and lacking in knowledge, i could easily say the same thing about yourself, as you seem to have a very blinkered view of the music industry. maybe you want to be a bit more open minded and less dissmisive.

i dont really see where i was judging anyone either, i was merely asking a few questions in an attempt to further understand the point you were trying to make, but like i said, for some reason it appears as if you took this a personal attack - i really dont get that

and finally you berate me about my atitude, well seriously, what the hell would you know about me, or my attitude - you make assumptions based on a couple of posts (that you totally missed the point of anyway) on an internet forum - how embarrassing for you

stating your opinion as if it is fact damages your credibilty - you obviously don't know as much as you would like to think that you do

so many aspects of music appreciation are subjective, opinions vary wildy on all matter of issues within the music industry - stating your opinions as if they are fact is very naive

and yes kyle sucks arse

BUT THAT'S JUST MY OPINION

Have a nice day :)

[Gotti]

When does Kyle ever bring that up as an excuse?

I know from experience when youve fought really hard at merely living, you just dont care what people think about you. You take what youve been offered and make the best of it. And Kyle has done marvellously.

I think that is people's general 'problem'. Caring too much about what other people think of them rather than just focussing on what has to be done. But hey..
i think he ment because people in this thread were defending him because he was once homeless, still waiting on that link

[SKYCRUISER]

was watching the Today show yesterday and Richard Wilkins was promoting and showing his G/F's track....total crock of shit too!

[DJ Fusion]

If my g/f was a singer and I owned a record label and was a radio DJ I'd spam her song so hard you'd think it was the only song on earth - any guy who wouldn't is a shit boyfriend imo.

[soulshine]

If my g/f was a singer and I owned a record label and was a radio DJ I'd spam her song so hard you'd think it was the only song on earth - any guy who wouldn't is a shit boyfriend imo.

Thats bullshit, you cant abuse your position of power to suit/benifit your own interests. Its totally unprofessional

[Gotti]

did anyone hear the piss-take about girlfriends songs by the frenzal boys on tripple J this morning, something about a dead horse?

[DJ Fusion]

Thats bullshit, you cant abuse your position of power to suit/benifit your own interests.

Not my interests, her interests.

And yes, that's how I operate, go nuts.

[soulshine]

Not my interests, her interests.

And yes, that's how I operate, go nuts.


Whatever Mr Fusion. To be honest I’m not even going to get into any arguments with you anymore. You never offer anything to any debate, you only try and find fault in other peoples comments.


Ktnxbye!

[DJ Fusion]

Fuck, thats heartbreaking man - I really cared about changing your opinion too... :boring:

[Lady Lex]

If my g/f was a singer and I owned a record label and was a radio DJ I'd spam her song so hard you'd think it was the only song on earth - any guy who wouldn't is a shit boyfriend imo.

Agreed. Whats wrong with it? The connections are there to be had. Why not make the most of it if its on your plate? Who says anyone is abusing any 'position of trust"?

[soulshine]

Agreed. Whats wrong with it? The connections are there to be had. Why not make the most of it if its on your plate? Who says anyone is abusing any 'position of trust"?


Who said anything about ‘position of trust’? Stop putting words in my mouth, I said a position of power.

I wouldn’t do it, it’s unethical. But then again some people have lower standards of ethics.

And it all boils down to the whole ‘it’s not how good you are, it’s who you know’ debate. So thanks for making your stances quite clear.

[Xpose]

Face it the whole music scene unfortunately is all about who you know, who your demo gets handed too and what power they have.

People with connections will always be put on first and purists will always have to dig for quality.

[Lady Lex]

ok, i wasn't going to respond, because you obviously have very rigid opinions about this, so much so, that it appears as if you took my opinions personally & were blinded as to the point i was trying to make - so what's the point with arogant people like yourself that think they 'know it all''

my theories as you like to call them, are nothing more than a personal observation and opinion (as i went out of my way to try and emphasise in my original posts)

i don't know that session muso's arent doing their own thing, infact i presume that a large number probably do - the point i was trying to make is that imo if a muso is exclusively doing session work, i believe that they are to some extent not being true to themselves JUST MY OPINION

everyone want session muso's to play with them? that is your opinion and definitely not a fact - so don't claim it as such

new muso's can also be self taught and a lot of them seek a broad range of influences in the development of their musical values - they also inspire themselves and benefit in the area of originality - it still 'lives on' - inspiration can come from absolutely anywhere

they inspire, maybe but so do a hell of a lot of other things when it comes to making music

not all session musicians are merely asked to do the job - some of them are nothing more than guns for hire - musical whores

you claim that i am ignorant and lacking in knowledge, i could easily say the same thing about yourself, as you seem to have a very blinkered view of the music industry. maybe you want to be a bit more open minded and less dissmisive.

i dont really see where i was judging anyone either, i was merely asking a few questions in an attempt to further understand the point you were trying to make, but like i said, for some reason it appears as if you took this a personal attack - i really dont get that

and finally you berate me about my atitude, well seriously, what the hell would you know about me, or my attitude - you make assumptions based on a couple of posts (that you totally missed the point of anyway) on an internet forum - how embarrassing for you

stating your opinion as if it is fact damages your credibilty - you obviously don't know as much as you would like to think that you do

so many aspects of music appreciation are subjective, opinions vary wildy on all matter of issues within the music industry - stating your opinions as if they are fact is very naive

and yes kyle sucks arse

BUT THAT'S JUST MY OPINION

Have a nice day :)

I always do. Regardless.

And dude: I dare you to go up to any session musician and tell them to their face theyre a sellout. You wouldnt have the balls. Far more embarrassment for YOU. Youre quite happy to write on and on about your own misguided opinions from 'personal observation' rather than EXPERIENCE but wouldnt have the balls to say it to someones face.

And PLEASE NOTE:Its your attitude and opinion to hold. But I stated that attitudes like yours annoy the krap outta me. Because it does.

Because you imply that session musicians are sellouts. That they are in it only for the money. That Original Music is 'where its at' when Ive clearly outlined that as a career, IT IS NOT. Being a musician is one of the hardest undertakings in this world. Do you know the most difficult degree in the world to attain is a Doctorate in Music? That is a worldwide and universal fact.

If any musician was to read through ANY of your posts, particularly the one I chose to respond to they would be absolutely gutted. But then again: its something a musician kinda gets used to in australia. Its a result of not understanding.

Musical whores? To think, all the time a muso spends on their craft and have people like you criticise them for trying to pay the rent.

And yes: every other muso LOVES playing with Session musicians. Because session musos are the utmost professionals - can read any chart at the drop of a hat; no need to explain what has to be done - because it gets done. And not only do Session musicians just play, they also enhance the other musos in the room with them. They add significantly to the vibe.

You dont believe in perhaps reconsidering your opinion? Have you chosen to stick to your one opinion all your life without considering there may be more out there? That in itself is mere arrogance. Look it up in the dictionary.

Me & Arrogance? So what? You think Im not arrogant enough to care what a person like you thinks about me? But dont worry precious - THERE ARE PLENTY MORE PEOPLE in Australia and the world who do appreciate musicians - regardless of what they play, who they play for, or why they play. Talent is talent and there is nothing in this world that can deny its worth and value. Not even you. Thank gawd.

[djsimonmann]

I like Kyle...

[Lady Lex]

Who said anything about ‘position of trust’? Stop putting words in my mouth, I said a position of power.

I wouldn’t do it, it’s unethical. But then again some people have lower standards of ethics.

And it all boils down to the whole ‘it’s not how good you are, it’s who you know’ debate. So thanks for making your stances quite clear.

How is it unethical for him to make use of that network that he has carefully nurtured and added to?

Sure its who you know. But whats the point of 'knowing people' when you cant come up with the goods? People want to continue knowing you because they know you will deliver.

And sorry about the wrong choice of words.

[Davomaxi]

Who said anything about ‘position of trust’? Stop putting words in my mouth, I said a position of power.

I wouldn’t do it, it’s unethical. But then again some people have lower standards of ethics.

And it all boils down to the whole ‘it’s not how good you are, it’s who you know’ debate. So thanks for making your stances quite clear.

Exactly it's unethical and should be frowned upon IMO.

[BumblingBee]

ladylex your comments ate nothing more than elitist piffle

not worth arguing with

apart from saying that you need to expand your musical horizons a bit

session muso's are not gods

also, it's nice to see you make some more idiotic assumptions about me

grow up

:slap:

[Lady Lex]

:lol:

[DJ Fusion]

I wouldn’t do it, it’s unethical. But then again some people have lower standards of ethics.


Well some people wouldn't download the Stewie Griffin movie off the internet 2 months before it's realeased either as it's flat-out illegal, but I guess you place your bureaucratic-style personal code of ethics above following the basic laws of our country.



:lol:


Totally agreed.

[soulshine]

How is it unethical for him to make use of that network that he has carefully nurtured and added to?

Sure its who you know. But whats the point of 'knowing people' when you cant come up with the goods? People want to continue knowing you because they know you will deliver.

And sorry about the wrong choice of words.

It’s unethical because he isn’t giving talented musicians a fair go. Instead he is abusing his position to benefit his personal life.

So you wouldn’t be pissed off if you went for a job, had all the qualifications, but someone with little to no qualifications got it because they new the employer…? Imagine if the government operated that way, oh wait, it already does.

Just cause it’s the way it is doesn’t make it ok.

Anyway, I cant spend anymore time in here today. Nice talking to you all. Have a productive day everyone.

[Lady Lex]

Session Musicians are still musicians.

And yes: All quality musicians are gods. Just ask their enraptured audiences.

[soulshine]

Well some people wouldn't download the Stewie Griffin movie off the internet 2 months before it's realeased either as it's flat-out illegal, but I guess you place your bureaucratic-style personal code of ethics above following the basic laws of our country..

see what i mean, jumping to assumptions again. My flatmate downloaded it and watched it last night. what was i meant to do sit in the garden till it was over.

im gonna say this as politly as i can....

fuck off,

yours sincerly,
soulshine

[Lady Lex]

It’s unethical because he isn’t giving talented musicians a fair go. Instead he is abusing his position to benefit his personal life.

So you wouldn’t be pissed off if you went for a job, had all the qualifications, but someone with little to no qualifications got it because they new the employer…? Imagine if the government operated that way, oh wait, it already does.

Just cause it’s the way it is doesn’t make it ok.

Anyway, I cant spend anymore time in here today. Nice talking to you all. Have a productive day everyone.

Who says he isnt giving talented musicians a go?

And are you saying that that DOESNT happen now in any industry?

Folks, this is the music industry. Its the way it operates. I would love to see it change it. But hey - get to know the system and turn it around to make it work for you.

Seems Kyle is making it work for him quite well. And why not? Its there to make the most of. ANYONE CAN DO IT. :)

[Lady Lex]

see what i mean, jumping to assumptions again. My flatmate downloaded it and watched it last night. what was i meant to do sit in the garden till it was over.

im gonna say this as politly as i can....

fuck off,

yours sincerly,
soulshine

I dont think it was specifically towards you bunny. I think it was general. I like your posts.. dont go. :)

[djsimonmann]

I don't want to read all this waffle, what I can gather though is that session musicians aren't real musicians if they aren't in their own band?? Is that right?

[BumblingBee]

And yes: All quality musicians are gods. Just ask their enraptured audiences.

i wish you wouldn't state your opinions as if they are fact, it's really annoying - look i actually agree with large parts of what you are saying, but i also disagree with probably an equal amount - an internet forum is too hard a place to discuss something like this - it's to easy for misrepresentations and misunderstandings

you have obviously had exposure to parts of the music industry - it doesn't mean that you have seen it all & that's how you are coming across to me

i have also had exposure to the music industry and my perspective although different to yours, is one that is held by many within this industry

all i'm saying is that there is a whole other side to the way you are looking at it and i am not dissmissing session musicians at all

i just don't agree with you that they are the ultimate - god-like even

after all musicians are just people

[twistedbydesign]

If my g/f was a singer and I owned a record label and was a radio DJ I'd spam her song so hard you'd think it was the only song on earth - any guy who wouldn't is a shit boyfriend imo.


regardless of the quality of it right?
mmm, this is pretty much our point mate...nice


lex
to say Aussies as a whole dont want to hear original music is a bit ridiculous isnt it?

[DJ Fusion]

regardless of the quality of it right?


Nah, sif I'd go out with a chick who put out shit music... ;)

[Lady Lex]

Thats cool Bumble (mind if I call you that? I like that name).

Where have I ever said I am the be all and here all in the industry? I couldnt be bothered knowing everything there is to know. Mainly because so much of it is rather seedy and sad. but, as you obviously know, much of it is wonderful.

Thats fine - dont agree. There are plenty of happy audiences who DO agree. I would never ever ever call a musician, especially at the calibre of a session musician, a musical whore. Gigwhore - yes. Its a private joke amongst musicians so thats fine. But a musical whore - never.

Quality Musicians are gods.

See? Look at poor Simonman.. such opinions as yours about session musos has made him question. THAT is what happens when people like you go around calling them musicalwhores. Damn'ed Shame..

[bornslippy1984]

lex
to say Aussies as a whole dont want to hear original music is a bit ridiculous isnt it?

No - you have to remember that shes a musician, and that entitles her to make sweeping generalisations and ridiculous comments such as "quality musicians are gods" (see above). :lol:

Get off it. You're human, musicians are human, and are no better or worse than anyone else. The fact that they play musical instruments is great - I love it - but fuck me, did I miss the memo that said "if you can do something well, you are a deity"?

Music is not, believe it or not, the be all and end all in life. Talent is not to be brainlessly worshipped, more to be appreciated for what it is - someone doing something well.

[Lady Lex]

lex
to say Aussies as a whole dont want to hear original music is a bit ridiculous isnt it?

I hope Im wrong. Its difference in each demography too.. younger crowds tend to respond a lil bit more....

Usually, I see people staring at the musicians when theyre playing their originals (good stuff too) and after a bit, will turn away and talk to their friends or whatever - basically lose interest. Then the band will pull out superstition and the crowd goes nuts.

In Japan, for example: you just gotta pull out a western sounding tune and they go nuts! same band played their originals at a gig in Japan - the crowd just went crazy. Im confoosed. As you can see. :)

[MadMike]

Agreed. Whats wrong with it? The connections are there to be had. Why not make the most of it if its on your plate? Who says anyone is abusing any 'position of trust"?
Nepotism: Favoritism granted to relatives or close friends, without regard to their merit.

Again, "without regard to their merit".

OOH AAH I LOST MY BRA

Does it make sense yet?

[SpaceMonkey]

Why is it that session musos are often looked down on as somehow inferior to original musos by some, yet classical musicians are generally considered as elite? There's no real difference between a session rock muso and a classical musician in my opinion, they occupy an almost identical role within their genres.

[Lady Lex]

No - you have to remember that shes a musician, and that entitles her to make sweeping generalisations and ridiculous comments such as "quality musicians are gods" (see above). :lol:

Get off it. You're human, musicians are human, and are no better or worse than anyone else. The fact that they play musical instruments is great - I love it - but fuck me, did I miss the memo that said "if you can do something well, you are a deity"?

Music is not, believe it or not, the be all and end all in life. Talent is not to be brainlessly worshipped, more to be appreciated for what it is - someone doing something well.

Oh well. You is missing out ;)

Im not a musician BornSlippery. im in the music industry but I dont consider myself a musician - even with all my credentials. I aspire to call myself a musician one day. But hey.. I consider it a lifelong dream.

[Lady Lex]

Why is it that session musos are often looked down on as somehow inferior to original musos by some, yet classical musicians are generally considered as elite? There's no real difference between a session rock muso and a classical musician in my opinion, they occupy an almost identical role within their genres.

Weird eh! You should see the elitist attitudes within each instrumental group! Apparently Horn players are drunks, Drummers dont understand music, Bass Players are failed guitarists, woodwind players are old women, violinists are snooty, pianists play too fast, opera singers are annoying cos they sing all day in and out, tenors are snooty.. gee..

Who knows. But yeh: all quality musicians are quality musicians.

[SpaceMonkey]

opera singers are annoying cos they sing all day in and out,

That one I'll agree with, my gf used to live with one. She didn't even walk around singing arias either, she walked around singing Avril fucking Levigne!!! The she had the cheek to complain about her sensitive musicians ears when the smoke alarm in our place went off.... what about my sensitive music fans ears having to put up with her incessant caterwauling?

[Lady Lex]

Nepotism: Favoritism granted to relatives or close friends, without regard to their merit.

Again, "without regard to their merit".

OOH AAH I LOST MY BRA

Does it make sense yet?

See, my problem is: I have heard her live many a time. And she is great. Nice voice, (lovely voice actually), basic guitar but nice all the same.
So 'without regard to her merit' wouldnt be applicable unless she actually was bad ala Ashlee Simpson bad.

And again I say: So what?

How is it any different to any industry or anything else in this world?

[DJ Fusion]

And also on the 'without regard to her merit' comment, I'd say that she's on equal par with the majority of other artists played on 2DayFM.

[ViRaL]

props to VQ for appropriate use of the word "Asshat" ..

[Lady Lex]

That one I'll agree with, my gf used to live with one. She didn't even walk around singing arias either, she walked around singing Avril fucking Levigne!!! The she had the cheek to complain about her sensitive musicians ears when the smoke alarm in our place went off.... what about my sensitive music fans ear's having to put up with her incessant caterwauling?
:lol: imagine being in a room with 250 of them! I used to be a repetiteur.. omg Space Monkey... worst 3 months of my life EVER! :lol: STFU Diva!

[BumblingBee]

See? Look at poor Simonman.. such opinions as yours about session musos has made him question. THAT is what happens when people like you go around calling them musicalwhores. Damn'ed Shame..

look maybe i was a bit blinded by my dislike of the whole idol concept in my initial posts, but yes i do believe any musician that associates themselves with this program is a sellout and a musical whore ;D (but hey sometimes you have to be & you gotta do what you gotta do) - and that is not to say that if i was in the situation where i was offered work as a musical contributor on australian idol that i would knock it back - it would depend on the $$'s being offered

hypocritical and lacking in principle - totally

but yes, it's also the reality of trying to survive in the australian music industry
- money is in short supply and sometimes you may have to compromise your principles merely to survive

doesn't make it right and doesn't mean i have to agree with it - it's just the way it is i guess

like i said these forums are open to things being mis-understood/construed/represented and if you think that i don't aprreciate good music, or musicians then you are totally incorrect

i guess that the unfortunate reality of the oz music industry is that you may have to sell your soul to survive in it ;D

[Lady Lex]

Sad aint it Bumble? But thats prolly the unfortunate part of any industry I guess.

I laugh at my idealism from when I was 17. "Im gonna grow up and be a concert pianist virtuoso and practise 16 hours a day!" I miss that idealism and 'innocence'.

Australia is just a very small market. I assume its very close to that in many parts of the world though... from talks with other musos it appears to be...sorta. Apparently, if you make it here, you have the strength to make it almost anywhere (doesnt mean it happens; just means you can deal with it). During the 60s, Miles Davis and John Coltrane were paid for their sessions with drugs. they never actually had any $$ in the bank, but they were happy ! Damn Columbia ... playing upon people's vices :X

[MadMike]

See, my problem is: I have heard her live many a time. And she is great. Nice voice, (lovely voice actually), basic guitar but nice all the same.
So 'without regard to her merit' wouldnt be applicable unless she actually was bad ala Ashlee Simpson bad.

And again I say: So what?

How is it any different to any industry or anything else in this world?
The issue is not with her or her ability to sing. Hearing her live is completely irrelevant.

The small issue is that he is playing her shitty song.

The bigger issue is that you and people like you are willing to accept nepotism unquestioningly. That the music industry is full of under-handed deals and back-slapping which undermines consumer confidence.

[Lady Lex]

I doubt one album (no matter how many units are sold) is going to undermine consumer confidence. The market for that album was directed specifically toward a demographic that have no clue about true quality music (eg Jazz, etc). As most of the tunes released thru Southern Endmole/Austereo are.

And your comment is not applicable ONLY to the music industry.

Business is war Mike. There is no honour when money is a significant motivater.

The underhanded deal and backslapping you are speaking of, are not usually with the talent. It is with the glorified business men who pass themselves off as CEOs. But Kyle has waltzed in there and taken that from them and effectively cut the middle money hungry guys out. Good on him. For once, the talent has their cake and gets to eat all of it.

[MadMike]

So you have no moral qualms with nepotism?
You are an advocate of grabbing whatever opportunity comes your way regardless of whether you deserve it or not?

[soulshine]

For once, the talent has their cake and gets to eat all of it.

That remains to be seen.

/edit, and i think he's had enough cake.

[Xpose]

I doubt one album (no matter how many units are sold) is going to undermine consumer confidence. The market for that album was directed specifically toward a demographic that have no clue about true quality music (eg Jazz, etc). As most of the tunes released thru Southern Endmole/Austereo are.

And your comment is not applicable ONLY to the music industry.

Business is war Mike. There is no honour when money is a significant motivater.

The underhanded deal and backslapping you are speaking of, are not usually with the talent. It is with the glorified business men who pass themselves off as CEOs. But Kyle has waltzed in there and taken that from them and effectively cut the middle money hungry guys out. Good on him. For once, the talent has their cake and gets to eat all of it.
Im tipping he isnt gonna buy much cake on the back of her sales.

[Lady Lex]

So you have no moral qualms with nepotism?
You are an advocate of grabbing whatever opportunity comes your way regardless of whether you deserve it or not?

are you kidding?

Its a lasseis faire soceity we live in: if its there for the taking and you can deliver: DO SO.

I believe in making everything an opportunity if its at all possible.

Whats wrong with that?

[MadMike]

laissez-faire

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. Our moral compasses point in different directions on this.

[Xpose]

are you kidding?

Its a lasseis faire soceity we live in: if its there for the taking and you can deliver: DO SO.

I believe in making everything an opportunity if its at all possible.

Whats wrong with that?
Ask Renee Rivkin and Steve Vizard. ;)

[soulshine]

are you kidding?

Its a lasseis faire soceity we live in: if its there for the taking and you can deliver: DO SO.

I believe in making everything an opportunity if its at all possible.

Whats wrong with that?

Even if it involves hurting others who may be better suited/worked harder for the role?

[Lady Lex]

*scoff.

Like no one in this world doesnt hold the same business philosphy.

What are you all? inhuman? yeh riiiiiight...

And X: they pushed the boundaries too far for their own gain. For me, it aint about gain. Its about The Music.

[MuntedRaver]

If any1 has 5 seconds free (of course u do ur on ITM) then how bout sending a request for your favourite Franzal track to www.kyleandjackieo.com/contact.php

I suggest:
Get fucked you fucking fuckwit you can't move into my house

U.S.A.N.U.S

or any other offensive title of which Frenzal have many

[MadMike]

*scoff.

Like no one in this world doesnt hold the same business philosphy.

What are you all? inhuman? yeh riiiiiight...

And X: they pushed the boundaries too far for their own gain. For me, it aint about gain. Its about The Music.Some people take great pride in knowing their achievements were all their own.

[Lady Lex]

Even if it involves hurting others who may be better suited/worked harder for the role?
Now YOU are twisting it all.

besides; Who says I wouldnt be better suited? You saying my Masters of Music & BMus degrees, and over 14 years of professional experience in the industry practically & acadmically, aint gonna qualify me for anything? but then again, I just aint anybody.

If I truly thought the best peson for the job deserved it, I would give it to them - and make sure they remember the favour.

[Lady Lex]

Some people take great pride in knowing their achievements were all their own.

Some?

how about everyone?

And how is Tamara releasing an album thanks to Kyle not an achievement in itself?
She IS a very good musician. She has done the hard yards and put the work into her craft. She also has the good fortune to have a partner with connections.

How is it any different to any other suffering industrious artist in the world?

Who are any of us to determine the value of a musicians worth? We cant! There is no price on talent.

[MuntedRaver]

Do you beleive Lex that these 5 minute wonders you seem to be defending may actually be taking up Label space, air time and performance opportunaties of musicians who a) write their own music b) perform their own music and c) love their own music?

I agree that they deserve a chance if they can get it, hey its not their fault their record labels have only $$ signs in their eyes, exploit it if you can (although chances are you may be the one who is exploited) . But why let some medicore 'star' take the place of a real deserving musician.

Case in point......where was Missy Higgins contract b4 Triple J unearthed her?

[SoulWhiteMan]

Hang about; I find it incredibly interesting you bought economic "laissez-fair" argument into it Lexy, and then said that.

Everyone has to compete, and to the victor belong the spoils...right?

Well, the competition here is slanted; because Kyles girlfriend got opportunities other people wouldn't if for no other reason than she was with some twat who is on the radio; having said that - I do not rate him as a radio presenter, think he is a tool and is lacking the main ingredient to be a "music personality", in that I think he has none.

Some woman, going out with some other talentless twat has an advantage over someone else. And this whole "Idol" load of bollocks is crap: using the industry and "popular opinion" to make a short term buck is utterly garbage. THere are a FEW expectations of bands being very very popular AND talented; but today the two are EXCLUSIVELY MUTUAL TERMS: to be popular; you don't neccesarily have to be talented.... we all know this....

The issue with people is that SUPPOSEDLY there should be a connection.... but sadly I cannot think of that many, other than The Dave Matthews Band.
So, you have a TV show only interested in ratings, with some self promoting "judging panel" and popular voting as the criterion. Channel 10 wants there ratings; whoeverthefucklabel signs them wants a quick buck.... it is not a legitimate search and display of talent, more than a meat market for a few JAMSTER club kiddies to go buy a few CDs and Channel Ten and whatever phone service they use for voting to make some money.

[big eddie]

^^ point.

[Xpose]

I'm impressed by the lengths he is prepared to go to for sex with a chick 11 years his junior!

[soulshine]

Some?

how about everyone?

She has done the hard yards and put the work into her craft. She also has the good fortune to have a partner with connections.

How is it any different to any other suffering industrious artist in the world?



You keep referring back to this chick, and defending her, which is fair enough, but at the same time you are admitting that untalented people can and should take advantage of the industry if they are in the know.

And I think you’re watering the Kyle thing down a bit. She has a partner who is exploiting his position as a national (is that station national, I don’t really know/care) radio station presenter and adding a track that has no merit (imo) to the play list and probably bumping some good talented original musician off said play list, all for his own glory. King Kyle records… jesus

In my eyes she will always be known as the chick who sucked dick to get where she is. I may be wrong but that’s the way I see it.

I like to believe there are people out there who would find it unethical/unfair to leapfrog over more talented deserved people in any industry or role. Anyway, these hack usually get shown up for who they really are so only time will tell.

[Lady Lex]

Im defending quality musicians being called MusicWhores.

and thats about it.

I look at things like if youve got the connections: lucky you. Make the most of it. Because if there IS someone out there far more talented than you, you need every chance you get to survive in this rocky industry.

But: if you have the talent, the drive, the ambition, the determination, you can achieve anything you want. Nothing is stopping you.

The thing with Idol: krap as much as it is, it does give musos opportunities. It does. The musos who back the idols. The musos who back Marcia because everyone wants her at their coprorate gigs. People who are inspired generally by Idol and believe in live music again. Its alright.

BTW: I equate Missy with Tamara. Very easy to, considering Ive kissed the hands of Joe Zaiwunul and Victor Bailey. (and I bet you are all asking: who are they?)

[Lady Lex]

You keep referring back to this chick, and defending her, which is fair enough, but at the same time you are admitting that untalented people can and should take advantage of the industry if they are in the know.

And I think you’re watering the Kyle thing down a bit. She has a partner who is exploiting his position as a national (is that station national, I don’t really know/care) radio station presenter and adding a track that has no merit (imo) to the play list and probably bumping some good talented original musician off said play list, all for his own glory. King Kyle records… jesus

In my eyes she will always be known as the chick who sucked dick to get where she is. I may be wrong but that’s the way I see it.

I like to believe there are people out there who would find it unethical/unfair to leapfrog over more talented deserved people in any industry or role. Anyway, these hack usually get shown up for who they really are so only time will tell.

So you dont think she deserves it. Big deal. And SHE IS NOT EXPLOITING it. Kyle has taken the opportunity himself - KING KYLE RECORDS?

Big deal. Just proves that anyone can do it. Imagine if you had the talent to back it.

In other words: if you ARE talented, youve got no excuse to make it yourself. And generally.. those with talent dont have any excuses.. cos they are recognised anyway - by their peers. I would much prefer to be recognised by my peers than the general public. Most times, the GP prove their taste is in their arse.

[big eddie]

This is starting to get confusing, the point has changed about 7 times now by my count.

[DJ Fusion]

In my eyes she will always be known as the chick who sucked dick to get where she is.

Thats a nice attitude towards women you have.

Her boyfriend of many years simply plays her song on his radio show and that's how you perceive it - that kind of response says far more about you than it ever could about Kyle or Tamara.

[konfuser]

yeah, regardless which marsalis brother is better, kyle is still an unfunny twat

[big eddie]

BTW: I equate Missy with Tamara. Very easy to, considering Ive kissed the hands of Joe Zaiwunul and Victor Bailey. (and I bet you are all asking: who are they?)

On what level are you comparing them? vocal ability or creative merit?

(note I don't like either of them)

(oh yeah I've heard of joe zawinul, jazz pianst right? dunno who victor bailey is sorry)

[soulshine]

Thats a nice attitude towards women you have.

Her boyfriend of many years simply plays her song on his radio show and that's how you perceive it - that kind of response says far more about you than it ever could about Kyle or Tamara.

Well its just awell this thread isnt about me then, isnt it. and i thought i told you to fuck off about 20 posts back

[Lady Lex]

dont be sorry Eddie. and kudos to you. Victor Bailey - one of the greatest bass players in the world.

Im not comparing them on any level. As Ive said: when ive kissed Joe & Victors hands, hell.. kinda pales into significance.

:lol: @ konfuser.

[big eddie]

My piano teacher when I was a youngin was pretty big on jazz, so I'd had a couple of lectures on that subject :P

[Lady Lex]

Who was your piano teacher Eddie?
just curious.

See.. another musician who has inspired and generated the love. awww..

[Xpose]

I Hated my piano teacher HATED. pisses me off because i regret not learning so much more.

[Goldfish]

i loved my paino teacher.. He was about 20, UNI student and very HOT :lol:

[Lady Lex]

Well its just awell this thread isnt about me then, isnt it. and i thought i told you to fuck off about 20 posts back
are you and Dj Fusion one and the same? (sorry if thats offensive to you both).

[Xpose]

i loved my paino teacher.. He was about 20, UNI student and very HOT :lol:
He was ever so dreamy and i stared into his eyes for hours ;)

mine was 60, dumpy, grey with a matching moustache AND female

[Lady Lex]

:lol: X: her name wasnt Dulcie? ;)

my piano teachers (3 of them) were Russian... It was very kewl. The greatest inspirations of my entire life. *sigh...

[Goldfish]

He was ever so dreamy and i stared into his eyes for hours ;)

mine was 60, dumpy, grey with a matching moustache AND female

youre just jealous