Are the days of professional photographers numbered?

[camerawarehouse]

It seems that everyone, myself included, wants to be a professional photographer these days. We live in a world of ever increasing visual stimulation but can that in itself support the growing interest from those wishing to make a living from photography?
Will truly talented photographers always rise to the top, or will commercial pressures force companies to turn towards the glut of free images available online? (e.g. Virgin Mobile's famous use of a flikr image without seeking model release (http://flickr.com/groups/central/discuss/72157600541608353/)).
Will the use of sophisticated post-production techniques kill the art of original photography?
I'm just interested to hear what you think of the state of the photographic industry at this time. Booming or imploding?

[limuel_inc]

This is a good topic, however, the word 'professional photography' is too broad in my opinion. Are we mainly referring to profressional fashion and social photographers?

[camerawarehouse]

The formal definition could range from 'anyone that supports themselves by (or derives their primary income from) taking photographs' to 'anyone that has ever sold a photograph', but I don't want to get into an argument about the definition of 'professional photographer'!

For the sake of this question, 'professional photographer' means anyone that considers themselves such.

[nettsu]

I don't want to be a professional photographer
I just enjoy expressing myself creatively through photography
and I enjoy photography
(well considering you changed your definition - I am a professional photographer - i've exhibited & sold work)

re: the virgin flickr thing
its a creative commons image
virgin didn't need the model release form
if anything the original photographer should have had one (as he marked the image CC)- but then again I don't they expected their image would be used. Virgin I don't think did anything illegal - unethical yes, but thats because they didn't ask or inform the original photographer.

Now what I think you will find happened with Virgin is that a graduate suggested a really good way of getting really cheap photos!

There will always be professional photographers
do you really want amateurs shooting brochures or catalogues?

[limuel_inc]

The formal definition could range from 'anyone that supports themselves by (or derives their primary income from) taking photographs' to 'anyone that has ever sold a photograph', but I don't want to get into an argument about the definition of 'professional photographer'!

For the sake of this question, 'professional photographer' means anyone that considers themselves such.

Dude, please!!!!! I have NO intention of starting an argument of any kind. Anyways, goodluck with your thread!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[camerawarehouse]

I don't want to be a professional photographer
I just enjoy expressing myself creatively through photography
and I enjoy photography
Thanks nettsu. Are you saying you'd be happy for your photographs to be used commercially without financial reward?
I have NO intention of starting an argument
I wasn't referring to your post specifically, I just meant that I didn't want the definition to get in the way of the subject.

[nettsu]

Thanks nettsu. Are you saying you'd be happy for your photographs to be used commercially without financial reward?

they have been a few times now
if I get the acknowledgment I'm happy enough with that
most of the photos thats happened to have been shit anyway :lol:

[camerawarehouse]

most of the photos thats happened to have been shit anyway :lol:
Nice work :thumb: ...but I guess that's partly my point! I understand what you mean about staged shoots, but it might be increasingly difficult to make a living from editorial type shots.

[nettsu]

Nice work :thumb: ...but I guess that's partly my point! I understand what you mean about staged shoots, but it might be increasingly difficult to make a living from editorial type shots.

well any monkey with a mopho is now a photo-journalist
look at any newspaper who's calling for readers to send in their photos
tada free photography and punters get to call their parents telling them they appeared on the newspapers website...

[camerawarehouse]

Yep, funnily enough I was just flicking through the Village Voice newspaper (http://www.villagevoice.com.au) included with this week's Southern Courier and they do exactly that "send your news and photo story ideas to..."

[bscobie]

I get paid to do photography, but i wouldn't call myself a professional (and niether would my photos)

I have alot of fun developing skills (here photography) and its pretty awesome seeing your work slowly improving.

There are alot of photographers around these days, but i think the better ones will naturally rise to the top :)

[MJKooLio]

I get paid to do photography, but i wouldn't call myself a professional (and niether would my photos)

I have alot of fun developing skills (here photography) and its pretty awesome seeing your work slowly improving.

There are alot of photographers around these days, but i think the better ones will naturally rise to the top :)


What bscobie said.

But also, in my case, not yet a professional photographer as it is not my 5 day wk job just yet! Working for a large media outlet like News Ltd., or The West Australia, Courier Mail or SUnday Telegraph, The Australian. Those are professional photographers. Ie Editorial or Sport whom are employed just as a photographer. I do work for a Newspaper/magazine and do get paid but its not Professional just yet! I'm working on my portfolio to work with larger papers just to be employed as a photog. But now I also get paid to shoot at night clubs for 3-5 nights clubs and for Magazine too. So I'm getting there. At least 7-8 large concerts a month, ie just went by Snow Patrol and Silverchair. Coming up Marylin Manson and JT to Kelly Clarkson next year and many more in between! Keeps me busy each weekend shooting the clubs and people/DJ's, concerts when they come round town and music festivals too. Trying to get into the Editorial stuff soon.

[Spectrum]

Without a doubt, there's a lot of amateurs being paid money to do weddings for mates on the cheap...

...but nothing is going to beat a talented professional.

But like talented studio music engineers, the industry has been diluted by every man and his dog with computer thinking they're a "pro".

[the_pezman]

you cant really include wedding photogs, theyre dead inside

in saying that im happy to be paid in booze to shoot my mates ceremonies... and not a sepia in sight :p


back on topic: i think its great that theres more semi pros like myself. makes the pros work harder for their beans and also blows some myths out of the water for the consumers thinking only "pros" can take a good photo

[durham]

hmmmm, but don't you think that it then undervalues the work of the professional photographer?

photographers are now potentially faced with the prospect of lowering their fees in order to compete with joe blogs who sends his mobile phone photo to the paper in exchange for bragging rights to his mates. meanwhile photographer has to branch into different areas to help pay for camera gear etc.

i'm not saying that this is necessarily true...just throwing it out there :)

[Whiskey Tears]

testing.. 6

[camerawarehouse]

...don't you think that it then undervalues the work of the professional photographer?

I think that, financially, it certainly does. If a suitable free alternative is available, why would someone pay? And more and more photographers are happy to provide images for 'bragging rights', 'booze' or 'acknowledgement', when they're not relying on the photography to put the food on the table. Don't get me wrong - I'm not suggesting there's anything wrong with that at all, just curious about the effect on the industry.

Out of interest, does anyone know what a pro would be paid by a national newspaper (for example) for the use of an image?

[smack bob]

I think with low cost digital SLR cammeras in everyone's hands there are alot of people out there calling themselves pro's that are nowhere near it. The guys I know that are pro's have usually assisted for several years and studied while doing that then gone out and battled for clients until they have a client base big enough to support themselves. It's hard work. Just because someone took a good photo one day and then got paid for it doesn't make them a pro and falling into a field that doesn't really require a high level of talent or skill also I don't think makes you a pro even if you get paid for it. A good test would be to go onto one of the photographic agent websites and look at some of the work of the guys that are represented and then go out and try and shoot something as good.

[lightsmith]

It seems immoral to me that people can make money from a photographer (or writer or other activity) without passing some of that money back to the person who made it possible - here the photographer.

Apart from "loss leaders" (to publicise yourself) there is little justification for allowing yourself to be exploited.

There are many excellent amateurs who photograph for the love of it and many of whom are way better than many professionals - they take the pictures they want and spend alot of time perfecting them. Professionals have to take the pictures their clients want and, importantly, are available when the client needs them. To make money in the mainstream markets you cannot spend hours on an individual image.

There is no substitute for the photographers (or artists) eye or the talents of a creative writer!

Just my personal thoughts ...

SLS