View Full Version : Traktor final scr vs Abelton live
Bokka77
30-Jan-09, 02:01pm
Hi guys,
looking to purchase one these products for playing live out. just wondering your thoughts on the pro's and cons. im playing regularly and are over burning cd's bpm and keying. but dont want to lose that dj feel. another thing i need to know if that beat mapper thing is a little out on traktor can you control and push into line with the cdj's, turnatbles.
Any info would be appreciated!!!
well go traktor if you want to dj more
youngman
30-Jan-09, 02:07pm
I use Ableton for producing but am giong to get Traktor because I love the act of DJing - they are very different applications...
Ive only ever used traktor 3 to muck around at home
and its easy as piss to get 3 tracks in the mix and cut it up badly without a monitor at all.. disgustingly easy really
I can only imagine how dirty easy the latest traktor is
the interface is just more like djing... but imo your more a music 'programmer' when using a program like traktor which syncs and keys it for you...
still lots of fun
Xelpmok
30-Jan-09, 05:45pm
ableton blows for mixing finnished tracks, well, it doesn't blow, but isn't instant gratification like traktor pro...
Bokka77
30-Jan-09, 06:20pm
ableton blows for mixing finnished tracks, well, it doesn't blow, but isn't instant gratification like traktor pro...
so your not rating ableton for live mixing???
your post bearly makes sense.
considering that, i think these are the general questions you're asking...
1. forget ableton if you want to "DJ". the sum of DJing finished tracks on ableton is making sure the track is autocued on the right spot. the program isn't designed for a DJ to mix 2 tracks. you might want to head over to the site and read about the product.
2. burning CD's is annoying, but hitting a venue with a sunken DJ setup is the definition if painful (luckily this is becomming less and less)
3. if you wish to auto beatmatch in traktor then you need to ensure your grids are right. if you actually intend to at least beatmatch then this isn't a problem other than the BPM might be slightly out. but considering you're gigging, you *should* be able to beatmatch in your sleep.
your post bearly makes sense.
considering that, i think these are the general questions you're asking...
1. forget ableton if you want to "DJ". the sum of DJing finished tracks on ableton is making sure the track is autocued on the right spot. the program isn't designed for a DJ to mix 2 tracks. you might want to head over to the site and read about the product.
2. burning CD's is annoying, but hitting a venue with a sunken DJ setup is the definition if painful (luckily this is becomming less and less)
3. if you wish to auto beatmatch in traktor then you need to ensure your grids are right. if you actually intend to at least beatmatch then this isn't a problem other than the BPM might be slightly out. but considering you're gigging, you *should* be able to beatmatch in your sleep.
So Sasha is auto-cueing then...Not Djing?
sasha doesn't DJ finished tracks.
but yes, it is an oversimplified version... but for your average electrohaus DJ it's close enough to the truth.
sasha doesn't DJ finished tracks.
but yes, it is an oversimplified version... but for your average electrohaus DJ it's close enough to the truth.
I've always found what sasha does intriguing..But never understood the complexity of how he gets parts of tracks-whether he purchases them, what sounds of his own he adds?..I mean , it would be near impossible for joe public to "DJ" like him wouldn't it??
avatar_karma
02-Feb-09, 05:09pm
I've always found what sasha does intriguing..But never understood the complexity of how he gets parts of tracks-whether he purchases them, what sounds of his own he adds?..I mean , it would be near impossible for joe public to "DJ" like him wouldn't it??
its sasha. he does what he wants.
lachainsworth
02-Feb-09, 06:42pm
I've always found what sasha does intriguing..But never understood the complexity of how he gets parts of tracks-whether he purchases them, what sounds of his own he adds?..I mean , it would be near impossible for joe public to "DJ" like him wouldn't it??
not really..youre not going to have the ridiculous unreleased material he has, but it is very possible to do all of the programming, looping, fx, tricks etc like him... ableton FTW!!!
J-radical
02-Feb-09, 08:27pm
if your over burning cd's, warping tunes is going to take hell of a lot longer.
Bokka77
02-Feb-09, 09:18pm
if your over burning cd's, warping tunes is going to take hell of a lot longer.
so its take longer to warp the tunes than burn? Is it imperative that you do warp them, i mean that is just to auto sync isnt it?? i dont need to auto sync, i can beat match well
ezywarp
20-Apr-09, 08:31pm
A tune can be warped faster than it can be burnt 99% of the time..
warping is essential.. If you don't warp tunes in ableton you are heading right for trainwreck central..
I read that sasha has his tracks subdivided into their different sections eg intro, break, chorus, break and so on.. This is a great way to do it and it is not hard at all but it is just as easy to keep the track as one sample, find the start point you are after in your headphones and trigger the sample from there..
Ableton has advantages like if you write your own tunes you can trigger your own individual parts which would be more of a fitting definition of a true live performance..
You can also incorporate VST effects but you can do this in traktor too.
if you are just playing whole tracks it is really just DJing which is no bad thing either..
the demo can be downloaded for free from the ableton website, you should give it a try and see for yourself...
If you don't want to loose that DJ feel then isay buy TSP or Serato
If you want ot start playing your own production use Ableton Live
Plenty of people use Ableton to DJ with :http://abletonlivedj.com/forum/index.php?sid=269700d5bf86aeb706c99177dfab913d
underhousearrest
20-Apr-09, 09:43pm
serato ftw, simple, easy only downside is no relative mode on cd's :(
The_Architect
26-Apr-09, 01:33pm
Ive never used traktor, but ive used ableton, and IMO ableton is more based on a production, midi, effects type system, launching effects and midi mapping for sample triggers and shit, but thats just my opinion..
ezywarp
27-Apr-09, 08:55am
Well that is exactly right.. Ableton is a DAW. It was designed to produce music not for DJing. It is just a cool coincidence that it can be used for DJing also. Best of both worlds.
kirrin_f
29-Apr-09, 07:52pm
Hey Mate I've got Traktor scratch & it's awesome I love it, I'm actually heading to Sydney in July to play with it there & got a couple of gigs that I'm going to play with coming up in 2 weeks, I haven't had any problems with it & I got a Macbook to use with it :) I use 2 turntables & beat match all myself coz I don't use Cd's I only know how to play Vinyl which isn't so bad, Traktor 3 LE i just got rid of it was ok. If you are going to get any of the Traktors get the scratch you can also use to scratch with Cd's if you play Cd's....
Underdog
29-Apr-09, 10:21pm
TSP = win for djing
ableton is fine if you wan t to produce or spend a couple of hours planning your set and not be spontaneous or react to the crowd ......
Well that is exactly right.. Ableton is a DAW. It was designed to produce music not for DJing.
no it wasn't.
It is just a cool coincidence that it can be used for DJing also.
no it isn't.
ableton was designed for live performance of pre-recorded clips (hence the name "Live"). I think it's more of a coincidence that it turned out to be a good way of producing music too. a lot of the elements of the program that make it a DAW have only been in the program for a couple of versions - the first version i had didn't even have midi, which made it pretty useless as a DAW.
to answer the original question: the two are very different programs
go with tracktor skratch if you want to dj in a traditional way, it's great for that and all you have to do is start the program to get mixing.
go with ableton if you are more interested in djing by taking tracks apart and putting them back together a la hawtin, voorn or sasha.
base615
30-Apr-09, 12:57am
TSP = win for djing
ableton is fine if you wan t to produce or spend a couple of hours planning your set and not be spontaneous or react to the crowd ......
Complete and utter rubbish, Ableton allows you to be much more spontaneous. As long as you've got all your tracks and tools organised you don't need to plan anything. I can have multiple tracks playing along with conga loops, acapella, whatever you want and it allows you to be as creative or uncreative as you want.
I used to use Ableton for production and swore I'd never DJ with it until I actually tried and I wouldn't go back now. The only people who say Ableton is no good for DJing are those who haven't put any effort into learning what it can do. I should know, I used to be one of them.
they're both pretty good in my opinion
you've just gotta spend the time learning how to use both and then the potential becomes clear
learn the limitations, the possibilities and use what's up top
it's the creativity that counts in the end...
Simon_Murphy
30-Apr-09, 09:13am
its sasha. he does what he wants.
QFT
Underdog
30-Apr-09, 07:23pm
Complete and utter rubbish, Ableton allows you to be much more spontaneous. As long as you've got all your tracks and tools organised you don't need to plan anything. I can have multiple tracks playing along with conga loops, acapella, whatever you want and it allows you to be as creative or uncreative as you want.
I used to use Ableton for production and swore I'd never DJ with it until I actually tried and I wouldn't go back now. The only people who say Ableton is no good for DJing are those who haven't put any effort into learning what it can do. I should know, I used to be one of them.
fair enough - were all entitled to our opinion and thats just my take from having tried ableton for playing sets and it just not having the same feel at all - if it works for you then go for it , maybe its more suitable if you play with more straight up 4/4 loppy stuff rather than multi genre, non quantised / live drumming type stuff (disco/funk etc)
ezywarp
30-Apr-09, 08:00pm
no it wasn't.
It was designed for creation of music before DJing, that was my point.
no it isn't.
I heard one of the guys who designed ableton say what I said in a video interview. Thats where I got my info. I think it was on a CM mag disc or something.. I'll see if I can dig it up.
Maybe it didn't used to have midi... In all fairness to you I didn't actually know that, but I have been using it since 4 which came out a number of years ago now and has had midi in 4 versions since then so I think it's pretty safe to say it is a DAW now... I don't thinks there is much of a chance a new comer is going to start out on a version that has been superseded several times.
I know it was designed for live performance but that is not the only thing it was designed for.
base615
30-Apr-09, 08:40pm
fair enough - were all entitled to our opinion and thats just my take from having tried ableton for playing sets and it just not having the same feel at all - if it works for you then go for it , maybe its more suitable if you play with more straight up 4/4 loppy stuff rather than multi genre, non quantised / live drumming type stuff (disco/funk etc)
That's definately more difficult but once you've got your head around warping tracks and have experience with it, it's no problem. I was using Ableton for nearly four years before I used it to play out so I knew it like the back of my hand already.
I know plenty of people who try it for production and hate it because it's such a different concept if you're used to another sequencer. When I first used it I struggled to get out of Arrangement view because I was so used to a atandard left to right sequencer. Like everything, if you're used to one way of doing things it takes a while to change.
I understand that some people don't like to use it themselves and that's obviously fine but it really gets on my nerves when people slate people who do use it or call it lazyness when they don't have any experience of using it (You didn't do that by the way, it's not aimed at you :))
ezywarp
11-May-09, 12:17pm
you're exactly right.. You always see people who write it off because it does everything for you but it's not the case..
Firstly you need to warp the tunes you play.. It's not very hard and you only need to do it once.. but lets face it.. how hard is it to beatmatch?.. You can get a tune in time in a couple of seconds once you have had a bit of practice.
Besides.. If you are the best beatmatcher ever.. No one will ever notice or care. unless you mess it up.
You can mix perfectly every time with absoloutly no mismatched timing whatsoever and still do a boring set.
What you do after the tunes are in time is what really matters...
There is a whole multitude of options that are opened up when DJing with ableton like using dummy clips to trigger various automation patters on different effects. The ability to instantly trigger from part of a break in one track to a part of the intro/outro without needing to cue up. Incorporating VST effects.. Adding individual elements of your own tunes.. If you have written enough of your own tunes you can do complete live sets.
It can take a bit to get your head around but once you do you can see just how much of a powerful performance tool it can be.
At the end of the day it's all about the music.. not how you do it.
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