Ideology Of The DJ [Archive]

avatar_karma

18-Jan-10, 06:09pm

I read this arguement somewhere a long time ago:

Anyone can get a collection of tracks and put them in a playlist and play them one after the other. The point of a DJ is to take this collection and put them together is such a way that this seemless piece of music is better.

That is: whole > collection of parts

And this is how I think about my mixing, making sure that the way I have a mix is greater then just playing the tracks one after the other in a playlist. Is this how you think about mixing?

Taking this further you can see why the concepts such as Richie Hawtin's "DE9 | Closer To The Edit", Magda's "She's A Dancing Machine" & more recently Joris Voorn's "Balance 014" come about. They are taking parts, and trying to put them together in such a way to create a piece of music that is better together then is the sum of the parts. They are even doing it (in these concepts) to create whole new songs constructed from sometimes 4 beat loops.

Discuss?

seannash

18-Jan-10, 06:21pm

macc4

18-Jan-10, 06:27pm

i think its extremely cocky for a dj to think that they can make a track better than the original artist intended to be.play the tracks in there entirety.you liked them enough to buy them,have the decency to play it the way it was made

Take a deep breath, relax. Most EDM is made with an intro and an outro, it's almost like they are made to be mixed!

camlv

18-Jan-10, 06:51pm

And this is how I think about my mixing, making sure that the way I have a mix is greater then just playing the tracks one after the other in a playlist. Is this how you think about mixing?

No, I think about mixing as seamlessly mixing two songs together to achieve the appropriate energy and vibe.

Edstacee

18-Jan-10, 06:55pm

It's about both, depending on the time, place, vibe and crowd.

There you go.

seannash

18-Jan-10, 06:58pm

Take a deep breath, relax. Most EDM is made with an intro and an outro, it's almost like they are made to be mixed!
yep mixed into another track,not chopped to shite beyond recognition like the OP was atesting to.

quantum8

18-Jan-10, 07:12pm

yep mixed into another track,not chopped to shite beyond recognition like the OP was atesting to.

or flanged/delayed beyond awesomeness recognition

slackas

18-Jan-10, 07:39pm

As a DJ... is say... Do whatever you have to do, use whatever technology that you like... to take your audience on a musical journey...

If your not doing this, even in its basic form of starting at a low BPM and moving higher... What are you doing?

pEAkeR_hAT

18-Jan-10, 07:52pm

pulling bitches ^

slackas

18-Jan-10, 07:53pm

pulling bitches ^

Guess thats how they do it in WA...

Freund

18-Jan-10, 07:58pm

I don't think the OP is suggesting that one needs to cut up tracks, use effects, layer everything etc. in order to make a mix more than the sum of its parts...

4Sirius

18-Jan-10, 08:05pm

"I'll take Music for $1000 Alex."
i think its extremely cocky for a dj to think that they can make a track better than the original artist intended to be. "What is sample based music production?"

DFA1979

18-Jan-10, 08:13pm

There's djing and then theres djing though. Theres nothing at all wrong with playing a house party and just doing really basic mixes with whatever tracks you feel like.

If you take it more seriously though and want to take it to the next level then the structure of your mix becomes crucial. The OP wasnt trying to say he can do a song better justice than the original artist but more that these tracks become part of what he does as a DJ

tmfllr

18-Jan-10, 08:32pm

macc4

18-Jan-10, 08:35pm

Some dj's deserve credit, just like the originals band deserves credit over the covers band, even though the covers band packed out the pub and everyone danced.
(No one turned up for the originals band because no one had even heard of them)

pEAkeR_hAT

18-Jan-10, 08:36pm

Guess thats how they do it in WA...

lol how can you talk,

you mix hardstyle, hardtrance, and house. Which are easily the 3 shittest genre's in EDM

:thumb:

slackas

18-Jan-10, 08:42pm

lol how can you talk,

you mix hardstyle, hardtrance, and house. Which are easily the 3 shittest genre's in EDM

:thumb:

I dunno, i think DnB as a whole is pretty shitty... but its all about opinion right? :boring:

Funkedub

18-Jan-10, 08:48pm

My favourite sets (mix CDs) of all time are ones that span a multitude of genres. For me, that's an essential aspect of being a DJ. Someone who actually thinks outside the boundaries of 2-3 similar genres and creates a selection that actually goes places instead of merging together 80 minutes of the same tempo.

Coldcut's 70 minutes of Madness (or Chemical Brothers Live at the Social) = fantastic DJ idealoogy

piecing together the beatport top 10 = trite tedium

Of course there will be those that shout out cliches like "but as long as the punters enjoy it ... blah blah blah". Well label me an elitist prick, but i have no time for people entertained by the latter of the 2 choices above.

yea, i'm a music snob ... fuck you if it offends you.

Shifty-Sly

18-Jan-10, 09:08pm

Depends on what's actually happening here people....
Are you playing at a club or home? If club is it rammed or empty? You playing 1hr or 4? Is the place/night you are playing genre specific? There are alot of things that influence the way I play...... On a side note never had punter come up and tell me how sick the journey they just went on was lol

pomrocks

18-Jan-10, 09:29pm

i like to play music i like

pretty simple aye

bulldozer

18-Jan-10, 09:36pm

On a side note never had punter come up and tell me how sick the journey they just went on was lol
that means your doing it wrong

SlicyDicer

19-Jan-10, 12:03am

What he said ^

I've literally had dudes come and offer me blow jobs because I was that good. I accepted of course.

divid3d

19-Jan-10, 12:28am

i don't usually go up to DJs after a set, but i did find matt radovich after one of his sets and promptly thanked him for "that awesome headfuck of a set" :-D couldn't help it, he needed to know how wicked it was :P

as for the topic at hand, i agree with what most people have said in one way or another. DJing is a lot of different things to different people, and the purpose of a DJ will depend on many factors (venue, audience, etc). i can't think of a single 'correct answer' to describe 'the point of a DJ', there are too many variables.

Matty_neal

19-Jan-10, 12:32am

It's all relative. A DJ can be someone who simply gives a venue a fun, upbeat vibe. A DJ can also be the star of the show. I don't think people realise how loose the word DJ is, it's like saying all musicians are the same, be it a rock band or an orchestra.

When you think of a musician, many things come to mind. They could be the pianist in a symphony or the guitarist in a pop band. The same goes with DJ's.

Shifty-Sly

19-Jan-10, 08:32am

What he said ^

I've literally had dudes come and offer me blow jobs because I was that good. I accepted of course.

well I don't play @ gay clubs :lol:

I don't mean punters have not given me compliments on my sets I mean nobody has ever used the word JOURNEY......

deadly

19-Jan-10, 09:08am

It depends on what they are paying you for imo

KillaKowalski

19-Jan-10, 09:30am

"Richie Hawtin's "DE9 | Closer To The Edit", Magda's "She's A Dancing Machine" & more recently Joris Voorn's "Balance 014" "

3 quite boring mixes right there.

well balance 014 is ok, still not that re-listenable (maybe its because Voorn is a not a bad producer)

I prefer a dj just picking good tracks (not all the same), mixing them well together (appropiately to style though, I don't need a beatmatched hip hop set) and it flowing nicely to create something interesting to listen to.

Spicy

19-Jan-10, 11:06am

i think its extremely cocky for a dj to think that they can make a track better than the original artist intended to be.play the tracks in there entirety.you liked them enough to buy them,have the decency to play it the way it was madehehe interesting view and i guess that's pretty respectful, but what about if you like one part of a track but not so much the rest?

you should have a read about how some of the oldschool house DJs (frankie knuckles in particular from memory but my memory is poor, probably larry levan too) did it. they bought doubles of every record they could, play it for the first time at the club and see which part of the track the crowd reacts to the most, and then next time play just that part, then cue up the same part on the other record, drop it in, then back-cue the first record to the same part of the track, drop it in, etc.. and that's just one part of a whole tune. but it's the part the crowd loved the most!

haha where would DJing and EDM be today without house music eh? :P

seannash

19-Jan-10, 11:23am

hehe interesting view and i guess that's pretty respectful, but what about if you like one part of a track but not so much the rest?

you should have a read about how some of the oldschool house DJs (frankie knuckles in particular from memory but my memory is poor, probably larry levan too) did it. they bought doubles of every record they could, play it for the first time at the club and see which part of the track the crowd reacts to the most, and then next time play just that part, then cue up the same part on the other record, drop it in, then back-cue the first record to the same part of the track, drop it in, etc.. and that's just one part of a whole tune. but it's the part the crowd loved the most!

haha where would DJing and EDM be today without house music eh? :P
yeah this is what alot of hip hop djs did,they played the break of the track switching between two copies to give a beat that an MC could rap over.
That is all well and good,there still playing the track not adding more effects/instruments/samples and thinking there making the track better.

i know that sampling is an important part of house music and when its used to make a song alot more than just a sample goes into making that track sound pro.

i just dont think a dj should hack up tunes,if i heard someone cutting a track i loved up to shreds it would turn me off no end.
but that could be me alone on that stance especially with all the abe jocks around talking about "the possibilities"

i just dont think people want those cut up sets anymore.i think its going back to song selection and decent mixing,not overly effected sets

macc4

19-Jan-10, 12:07pm

i just dont think

you don't think, but you can speak for everyone?

Some music is made for the purpose of layering, take minimal techno for example, you need at least 2 tracks playing or the seagulls will try and breed with you

seannash

19-Jan-10, 12:43pm

you don't think, but you can speak for everyone?

Some music is made for the purpose of layering, take minimal techno for example, you need at least 2 tracks playing or the seagulls will try and breed with you
eh yeah I dont think

that is what i said right "i"

when did i say we.

and sorry mate but minimal techno is not made for having two tracks playing at the same time,

KillaKowalski

19-Jan-10, 12:51pm

imo it needs to be layered to be interesting.

seanious

19-Jan-10, 12:56pm

eh yeah I dont think

that is what i said right "i"

when did i say we.

and sorry mate but minimal techno is not made for having two tracks playing at the same time,

http://rgh.cc/albums/userpics/10144/SeriousCatAvatar.jpg

trenthalliday

19-Jan-10, 01:18pm

i like to play music i like

pretty simple aye

GTFO. Its not about music you like, its about the music that will make people think you're cool.

I'll teach you the way of the Jedi DJ soon my friend.

KillaKowalski

19-Jan-10, 01:20pm

Minimal techno is also made for people who can't dance very well.

quantum8

19-Jan-10, 02:12pm

it's funny how people jump onto other's personal opinions when theirs is different. just as EDM is pretty varied, so is the DJ's style, audience and intention

Minimal techno is also made for people who can't dance very well.

i thought that was dubstep?

;)

djaudiophile

19-Jan-10, 02:18pm

Funkedub

19-Jan-10, 07:02pm

^^^

Oh snap!! (http://mixes.djfez.com/mixes/2286/)

macc4

19-Jan-10, 07:04pm

:lol: was done on a dodgy mixer, so you'll notice the balance on one channel is a bit iffy sometimes

come on funkedub, you are better than that

djaudiophile

19-Jan-10, 07:58pm

^^^

Oh crackle, pop (1 channel)!! (http://mixes.djfez.com/mixes/2286/)

will check it out

Funkedub

19-Jan-10, 08:02pm

:lol:

come on funkedub, you are better than that

The mixer was pretty fucked ... it's not so noticeable on speakers .. but on headphones it's almost painful, so i felt obliged to let people know why :P

(PS: downloading audiophiles mix ... mostly cos it has that South Rakkas Crew track in it :P )

avatar_karma

19-Jan-10, 11:37pm

i think its extremely cocky for a dj to think that they can make a track better than the original artist intended to be.play the tracks in there entirety.you liked them enough to buy them,have the decency to play it the way it was made

To be honest dude, I think you read what I wrote the wrong way.

*sigh*

I like this:

I prefer a dj just picking good tracks (not all the same), mixing them well together and it flowing nicely to create something interesting to listen to.

and for it to be interesting to me it has to go on a journey.

And yes, you MUST layer minimal techno otherwise it gets shit boring.

i like to play music i like

pretty simple aye

Sif you don't think about where you want to go in the set with your next track. I know you don't just choose any old track to play.

KillaKowalski

20-Jan-10, 09:31am

journey is good, but sometimes you just want to dance.

There is a fair bit of wank factor in this whole journey thing, kind of like 'lifes journey' bla bla obviously the set has to go somewhere other wise it would get boring. But I don't always need a steady building set, all tunes feeding off the next, working in perfect harmony bla di bla, sometimes I just want to dance. Even if it's well done that can be boring sometimes, however though sometimes it can be amazing. It changes. I dunno... bleh {:-( {:-( {:-( :?

Over examining set aesthetics makes my head hurt sometimes, too many variables over what makes a good set.

pomrocks

20-Jan-10, 09:56am

Sif you don't think about where you want to go in the set with your next track. I know you don't just choose any old track to play.

:lol: have you heard me play? i've got a bad habit of playing a track that doesnt always flow too well

trenthalliday

20-Jan-10, 10:56am

:lol: have you heard me play? i've got a bad habit of playing a track that doesnt always flow too well

Dude dont be so hard on yourself.

Riverside will ALWAYS go well after Sexy Bitch.

slackas

20-Jan-10, 11:15am

Dude dont be so hard on yourself.

Riverside will ALWAYS go well after Sexy Bitch.

Must have FLANGER at some point... or its just not worth it....

avatar_karma

20-Jan-10, 11:58am

:lol: have you heard me play? i've got a bad habit of playing a track that doesnt always flow too well

Wait, is this when you and George are trying to out-cheese each other, or in a club.

:lol:

pomrocks

20-Jan-10, 12:00pm

Wait, is this when you and George are trying to out-cheese each other, or in a club.

:lol:

it's like a double hairy cheeseburger with extra cheese

Sideshow Rod

20-Jan-10, 12:01pm

sometimes too much thought can go into the process and it shows in the performance, some dj-s need to take it all less seriously and just have fun with it :thumb:

avatar_karma

20-Jan-10, 12:03pm

it's like a double hairy cheeseburger with extra cheese

Sounds like something from McDonalds. :nooo:

pomrocks

20-Jan-10, 12:07pm

Sounds like something from McDonalds. :nooo:

more line wimpy's bender in a bun with cheese

http://www.wimpy.uk.com/images/menu08/value/bendercheese.jpg

Elephanto

04-Mar-10, 12:39pm

IMO, just play good music in a cohesive manner. Just because you can pick 2/3 tracks (none of which you actually wrote), and layer them for 40 minutes to make something more "personal", or "intimate" - fucking bollocks - doesn't mean you deserve any credit.

"Just play good music". The perfect solution! Did you think that up all on your own or did you have some help? With a solution as complex, yet simple at the same time, surely there was an entire team dedicated to the cause. A think tank of epic proportions.