copyright

[jayjay]

ok... im 80% through making a new track and i was wondering what was required of me in relation to copyright laws b4 i send my track to a label???

i have sampled a beat from 1 track and i have also sampled a note from another. i have changed the note pretty much beyond recognision by the way.

so do i have to do anything b4 i send the demo to a label or does the label take care of the copyright issues??? and is it hard to gain permission to use samples of other peoples work???

[driload]

technically anything you sample should be cleared no matter how long or short or whatever


rarely happens though in real life. one of the labels we're on told us not to bother. i generally take care of everything myself and run with whatever risks i choose to take

there is such a grey area that no matter what you are told it usually doesnt matter.

remember that this is a CIVIL issue in legal land and rarely a contentious one. unless you blatantly sample Disney in a booty bass/pron track you wont find many people who'd go to such effort to proceed down the expensive and tedious legal path


what is the beat from?
and as for a NOTE, do you think anyone is going to hear or recognise it? thats why you rarely sample verbatim (or "as is").


one last interesting point is that legal precedant is VERY VERY important in the issue of sampling and copyright. in other words sampling james brown hits and the Amen break has been done for so long uncontested that it would be hard for the copyright holders to provide a reason why this case should warrant any proceedings.

oh and one last last thing is, its all about money, not law. you do the maths. the labels (including ours) are just going to laugh off the suggestion that samples be cleared, unless its something that will bite them in the butt.


thats why the music community was shocked when Avalanches cleared about 800000 billion samples (slight exaggeration) on their last record.

but that was a clever promotional technique too!

[phunkdust]

i wonder if Liam Howlett had to get clearing for samples of past prodigy hits? :lol:

[jayjay]

the beat is from a track called booty baby by da booty click. it is pretty much as is but i have chopped it up and looped parts. it isnt just the whole beat track laid out in my sequence with things over it. not like a bootleg sort o thing.

so basically. being another dance act themselves and probably sampling stuff on that track and the chance of them actually hearing it is pretty slim as well, there isnt much point on clearing stuff??? i know ur not gonna tell me not to coz then if i get in shit i could blame u (which i wouldnt) but its a pretty safe bet not to worry yeah???

neways... cheers for the heads up :D

will b looking for some1 to remix the track when im done so driload... u might just b the man fo the job if ur interested.

[driload]

sure sounds snazzy


i just wanted to get the point across that you will hear LOTS of information from these Tafe graduate types or Future Music readers who throw their *expert* text book reading knowledge at you about copyright

things is, i was shocked too when i found out the reality is very different to what the industry specifies



good luck, let us know when the tune is finished in the reviews thread...

[redmond_herring]

here here Driload - very good advice!

I nearly fell off my chair the first time a very well respected dj/prod told me to "sample to the ends of the earth - sample EVERYTHING - change them, morph them, cut them up, destroy them then rebuild them - much easier to make tracks with a longer lifespan"

and when asked bout copyright -

"bah! unless your madison avenue I wouldnt worry - dont use samples that can be instantly recognised, make sure you process them and its all good - labels can always ask for the same track with sample removed (for unsigned artists)."

Basically he's right. unless your getting an unspecified amount of cred/cash from a sample, stress less. Obviously However you may have to alter something if your label requests it.

:) :P :p


(the above was mainly reffering to one shot samples, old weird vocal hooks (which end up barely recognisable), weird licks from weird guitars, drone from strings, the neighbours cat, 1950's elevator music etc)

sampling entire beats (kicksnarehatpercussion) is rather diferent matter - much harder to clear, much harder to change etc.

[N4TE]

Here's a thought, what's a cheap and easy way to protect your own copyright?

The most simple and cheap method is to send yourself a copy of your track via registered mail. If the track ever comes into dispute (ie, some bastard pinches it), you've got 'exhibt a' for the court case right there in your third drawer.

Some tips. Buy a sturdy envelope or CD mailer, address it to yourself, put a copy of the track in there with a note quoting this is your track that you sent to yourself for the purpose of protecting copyright on your track "blah blah" as artist "yaddah yaddah" , put your name and the date on it, sign it and slip it in the envelope/mailer. Use masking tape to tape the bastard indisputably closed, then take it to the post office, get it weighed and pay the postage on it. The clerk will stamp the item, be sure to ask them to stamp across the edge of the masking tape. you now have a sealed package, date stamped by Australia Post, with your track inside it, which is pretty much all the evidence you'll ever need to proove you are the original artist behind the track, and nobody can produce any evidence even half as convincing to dispute that fact. The only place you would then open up that package would be in front of a judge at the court case. (I've got everything I've done since 1992 protected this way.)

[redmond_herring]

N4TE comes through with the goods - top advice.

Use the legal system or it will abuse you.

:) :P :p

[kaossproject]

nATE IS dA MAN!!!!!!

[N4TE]

Respect and credit to the late Leo Clelland, ex-band buddy and thinking man's idiot, for giving me that exact same advice all those years ago. So you see, I not da man, Leo da man, but Leo's dead, so get over it. :lol:

[EnglishBob]

I don't know where this stands legally, but if you post a track on mp3.com.au you have to enter artist details. When the track is then streamed from mp3.com it displays "copyright...your name"

Rob

Look and see http://www.mp3.com.au/Thrust

what a plug!!

[driload]

also, archive everything as you go


i dont do the infamous postal method (but im not going to start another flame war discussing why) yet i keep very detailed archives from the very first midi file/session/samples to whatever documentation accompanied it


if a dispute ever came to pass very detailed and extensive archives would go a very long way in showing the creative process which created the item in question


anyway, excuse me while i go hunt down the vhs of a certain late night movie i just saw on tv.... its going to get RAPED

[N4TE]

I promise not to start a flame war if you promise to spill any info or opinions as to why you don't do the registered post thing. by the way, whatcha pulling the samps off there Driload?

[zionisis]

JayJay

I'm an IP lawyer. driload is pretty much right - tho I'm not suppose to say that!!

I would say that honesty is the best policy with your label. If you say that you've used a couple of unlicenced samples that are unregonisable from the original and THEY say "don't worry about it", then I would advise that you seek a clause in your publishing/licensing/distrib deal to the effect that indemnify you against any suits (including claims/allegations) for breach of third party IP . . . may have to confine that to anything they have notice of.

If really concerned get indep legal advice. The law and it's practical effect in this area is a bit of a minefield.

(((this is not legal advice, this is not legal advice - I have to say that, insurance purposes, you understand!!!)))

Good luck.

Z.

[jayjay]

thanks for all the cool info guys :D

i will let the guys at subliminal know what it is that i have sampled and ask them to put a claues of indemnity in it for me ;)

btw... does any1 have the address for subliminal ;)