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Body Composition and Diet thread, Episode 2: All bets are off (The Marshening)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by mischa21 View Post

to be fair to Sir Lyle McDonald, the diet isn't that stupid. it in fact involves eating shitloads of veges and protein and makes you conscious of the importance of good carbs in moderation. it acknowledges it's not long-term, and provides a healthy maintenance diet to follow afterwards.

If I couldn't grate cheese on my abs, I probably wouldn't be so defensive about the diet

mmm cheese

Good to know it's helped understand those principles
But I'm not just talking about RFL, there are dozens of other quick-fix diets that are absolutely looney, eg lemon detox, soup diets, stupid ones that require you to reduce protein as rely on green veggies for 5 days, ones that tell people to stick to 1200 calories without assessing their circumstances etc. The problem I have with these diets is that it fails to teach them about what to eat to lose weight healthily and progressively.
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Originally Posted by Astro-Boy View Post

I actually find that when I'm in ketosis there's very little fluctuation.



For me, weight is a measure of progress and a tangible end goal. It's not a number that I base my happiness on.


That's because you're down to the wire then & the data you're seeing is probably mostly actual fat loss. No fluctuations with food weight, fluid issues. It's pure, unadulterated data. Sexy.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by mischa21 View Post

to be fair to Sir Lyle McDonald, the diet isn't that stupid. it in fact involves eating shitloads of veges and protein and makes you conscious of the importance of good carbs in moderation. it acknowledges it's not long-term, and provides a healthy maintenance diet to follow afterwards.

If I couldn't grate cheese on my abs, I probably wouldn't be so defensive about the diet

mmm cheese

It's true, I've seen her abs. I think that's why she defriended me - I kept 'liking' shit & then the pervy boys who weren't her FB friends would comment on it.

I honestly can't say if I was doing it deliberately or not
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Quote:

Originally Posted by loopi View Post

Good to know it's helped understand those principles
But I'm not just talking about RFL, there are dozens of other quick-fix diets that are absolutely looney, eg lemon detox, soup diets, stupid ones that require you to reduce protein as rely on green veggies for 5 days, ones that tell people to stick to 1200 calories without assessing their circumstances etc. The problem I have with these diets is that it fails to teach them about what to eat to lose weight healthily and progressively.

I don't think anyone here has ever advocated those sorts of things though.

rule number 1 of sperg club has always been - it's just maths stupid - calculate don't guess.
rule number 2 is that artificial sweeteners are the devil - that one hasn't been ratified yet

I never tell people to do RFL or any other ketogenic diet simply because its fucking horrible. The problem is that it is stupidly effective.

I do it because I'd rather have a few weeks of eating chicken, kangaroo & broccoli and not a lot else then going back to eating noodles and dumplings and beer like a normal person.

I know that water weight/glycogen etc effect the weight on the scales, I reckon if I tried, with carb loading but without saunas I could probably get an 8kg variance in my weight in a 24 hour period.

*but* all things being equal at the same time period, post piss in the morning, assuming similar hydration levels before bed in a glycogen depleted state - your fluid balance isn't going to be much different, particularly for males.

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I wasn't specifically talking about ITMers advocating those diets on here, these are just some the types of diets that the general public use purely to lose "weight" on the scales. New clients who come to me and want to drop "10kg" have deep-set issues with nutrition which are caused by these quick-fix diets, and what I'm advocating is a new approach that teaches them to monitor progress via measurements and body fat because it allows me to teach them how to eat properly. If I had a dollar for every time someone tells me they're eating 1200 calories to lose weight on the scales, I'd have a lot of dollars.

A lot of you guys know and understand the basics of macronutrient balance, supplementation etc. But the rest of society who follow Weight Watchers or shows like the Biggest Loser often find themselves obsessing over numbers at the cost of adequate nutrition. That is the problem I have with basing progress on scale weight; when it compromises good food and health, and is unsustainable, then it is not going to look after their bodies internally
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Interestingly enough the glycogen sparing/fat burning adaptations your body makes through distance running really seem to amplify the effects of ketogenic diets - I have become *noticeably* leaner in the last 3 weeks and that included a pretty epic 4 day bender in the middle of it.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Derelict View Post

I've got nothing.

At least we can agree on that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Heraclitus

Out of every one hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back.

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Originally Posted by Astro-Boy View Post

At least we can agree on that.

Is your sarcasm detector broken?
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The differences in my leanness over the last few weeks has been really noticeable. Dropped about 4 kegs but in terms of an overall body change, its just a much leaner look. I think I'm there.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Derelict View Post

Is your sarcasm detector broken?

No, I've just come to the realisation that sometimes having a conversation with you is like talking to a cinderblock.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Heraclitus

Out of every one hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by mischa21 View Post

The differences in my leanness over the last few weeks has been really noticeable. Dropped about 4 kegs but in terms of an overall body change, its just a much leaner look. I think I'm there.

Sup.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Astro-Boy View Post

No, I've just come to the realisation that sometimes having a conversation with you is like talking to a cinderblock.

Maybe it wouldn't be if you actually had a conversation with me rather than just paying out on me?

TRZA if you haven't seen the before an after pictures of loopi I suggest you look them up.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Astro-Boy View Post

No, I've just come to the realisation that sometimes having a conversation with you is like talking to a cinderblock.

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Thread now about loopi's life story.

Oh you're a PT? Williewonka.jpg

Who gives a fuck. Eddie just hit double digits bitch. And there's two chicks with eating disorders that bism reckons after a few beers are totally smashable. So what's the fucking problem??
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loopi halved her bodyweight from triple digits dude
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brb starving myself so I can fit in. sub 50kg come at me
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Everyone knows that skinny-fat is fine for girls anyway.

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I hate it when you're right and I'm not.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by loopi View Post

brb starving myself so I can fit in. sub 50kg come at me

My weight is diving because I'm in the process of a divorce & my body seems to have gone into fat burning overdrive since the marathon.

Not everyone wants to look like a botoxed peanut covered in fake tan standing on a stage in cheap stripper shoes competing with other hormonally imbalanced women.

Sorry if I appear rude, but Michelle Bridges & all her fangirls can suck my dick.

As you were.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Derelict View Post

Maybe it wouldn't be if you actually had a conversation with me rather than just paying out on me?

Righto, I've got nothing but time, lets have another crack.

Your opinion is (paraphrasing): That weight is just a number and has no real significance because muscle is heavier than fat.

Fact: Is is more dense than fat, it doesn't weigh more. That I don't dispute.

My opinion is: Weight is only a number if you don't exercise, and have little to no understanding of nutrition and physiological function. You might think that 200-300 grams of weight-loss over the course of two or three days is insignificant or obsessive, but I think it's important progress because I know that, if my body is in ketosis and I've eaten at a ~1000 calories deficit across those days (with most of the calories coming from protein), then the loss is going to be primarily fat being converted into energy. Tracking those small loss increments lets me know that I'm progressing and keeps me motivated.

The reason I paid out on you for hacking on about your big weekend where you lost whatever weight, is because surely you know that if you're not eating or sleeping then the process will be catabolism, and your body will be breaking down muscle to provide that energy.

I may have some of my terms arse-about there, so I welcome correction. In the grand scheme of things, what I know is fuck all. The most important thing to know is how little you know.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Heraclitus

Out of every one hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back.

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Sorry to hear about that Nads


FYI - I've never wanted to look like a botoxed peanut in fake tan :/
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s'ok, I thought everyone kinda knew.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by gotamangina View Post

Sorry if I appear rude, but Michelle Bridges & all her fangirls can suck my dick.

Who is Michelle Bridges - Is she related to Jeff or Beau Bridges?

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Originally Posted by gotamangina View Post

I hate it when you're right and I'm not.

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Or the Bridge over the River Kwai?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Heraclitus

Out of every one hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Astro-Boy View Post

Righto, I've got nothing but time, lets have another crack.

Your opinion is (paraphrasing): That weight is just a number and has no real significance because muscle is heavier than fat.

Fact: Is is more dense than fat, it doesn't weigh more. That I don't dispute.

My opinion is: Weight is only a number if you don't exercise, and have little to no understanding of nutrition and physiological function. You might think that 200-300 grams of weight-loss over the course of two or three days is insignificant or obsessive, but I think it's important progress because I know that, if my body is in ketosis and I've eaten at a ~1000 calories deficit across those days (with most of the calories coming from protein), then the loss is going to be primarily fat being converted into energy. Tracking those small loss increments lets me know that I'm progressing and keeps me motivated.

The reason I paid out on you for hacking on about your big weekend where you lost whatever weight, is because surely you know that if you're not eating or sleeping then the process will be catabolism, and your body will be breaking down muscle to provide that energy.

I may have some of my terms arse-about there, so I welcome correction. In the grand scheme of things, what I know is fuck all. The most important thing to know is how little you know.

I don't disagree with any of this. If you're on specific diets aimed to cut then of course the general weight loss matters, but it should be combined with the bf% and measurements as has been stated.

And believe me I know that bender weekends are not healthy, that's why I try to avoid them (I've only had two this year). Most usually start with a huge meal though which helps
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Derelict View Post

I don't disagree with any of this. If you're on specific diets aimed to cut then of course the general weight loss matters, but it should be combined with the bf% and measurements as has been stated.

And believe me I know that bender weekends are not healthy, that's why I try to avoid them (I've only had two this year). Most usually start with a huge meal though which helps

Fair enough. Maybe I'm just stroppy because I don't have access to calipers or dexascans, so weight is pretty much my only source of sweet, sweet quantitative data.

As far as qualitative data goes: My skinny jeans are now just jeans.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Heraclitus

Out of every one hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Astro-Boy View Post

As far as qualitative data goes: My skinny jeans are now just jeans.

Yerp - need to keep buying skinnier jeans. Although, I don't know how much wiggle room I have left on this front. Because they are getting hard to pull over my calves.

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I hate it when you're right and I'm not.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Astro-Boy View Post

My skinny jeans are now just jeans.

I went shopping yesterday for this exact reason.

Size 25 skinny jeans baggy in the arse. wtf.
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I'm rocking size 34 waist atm, but if all goes to plan should get back to 31-32
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Little boy hips, yes.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by gotamangina View Post

Sorry if I appear rude, but Michelle Bridges & all her fangirls can suck my dick.

lol my missus is doing the michelle bridges program or something

i put up with it until the following:
1. dinner was a vegetarian risotto.
2. low fat condensed coconut milk (pro-tip: if it doesn't contain coconut it's not coconut milk)

we have now reached an agreement where i am able to veto recipes that i think look shit
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If you guys actually still squatted skinny jeans wouldn't be an option

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Derelict View Post

gotamaarse

I'm rocking size 34 waist atm, but if all goes to plan should get back to 31-32

My 32s are loose @82kg.

You fat bastard.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Derelict View Post

gotamaarse

I'm rocking size 34 waist atm, but if all goes to plan should get back to 31-32

33" here right now fatty.
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I have much to learn.
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I'm still rocking 33".

I'd be good at childbirth.

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Still rocking (not really) size 36. Hopefully for not too much longer.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Gussigan View Post

lol my missus is doing the michelle bridges program or something

i put up with it until the following:
1. dinner was a vegetarian risotto.
2. low fat condensed coconut milk (pro-tip: if it doesn't contain coconut it's not coconut milk)

we have now reached an agreement where i am able to veto recipes that i think look shit


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Originally Posted by avatar_karma View Post

I'm still rocking 33".

I'd be good at childbirth.

Haha this. I may be a skinny **** but i do have big bones and wide hips. I also have a big arse, squats and deadlifts made it that way.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Derelict View Post

Haha this. I may be a skinny **** but i do have big bones and wide hips. I also have a big arse, squats and deadlifts pies made it that way.

fyp

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I hate it when you're right and I'm not.

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from six months of lifting?
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8 months. Let's see, before I had no arse, now I do have an arse, and the only thing that changed in that period was lifting weights (eating more to compliment this). It's really firm too u
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Maybe it got big from talking out of it so much
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maybe it's from the bit where you said you ate more
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Derelict View Post

8 months. Let's see, before I had no arse, now I do have an arse, and the only thing that changed in that period was lifting weights (eating more to compliment this). It's really firm too u

Just coincided with the early 20s skinny tradie to mid-20s on-the-way-to-fat tradie changeover.

Your plumbers crack is in the post

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I hate it when you're right and I'm not.

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Everyone is on fire today
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hopefully it got put in the wrong post box so it wont be round for years
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Lol
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Poor Derp, he's really been the butt of the jokes in here today
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