The DJ Booth

A very well constructed view on old vs new DJs

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Damionpell +

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A very well constructed view on old vs new DJs
It is refreshing to read a well written and constructed view of digital vs vinyl vs old skool vs new skool DJ's

http://behindthedecks.org/2011/07/13...dont-be-angry/
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lol watch out some wont like this at all

for me I dont care because its more aimed at club djs than mobile!
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"( Scottie B, the founder of Angry DJ T-Shirts, says he’s the UK’s #1 DJ and he made a T-Shirt about it so you have to assume maybe he’s getting requests too and he’s #1! )"


never heard of him

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@ Antis - i think thats the point of the Tshirt - it's a joke (like dj polls are)
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Quote:

Originally Posted by antis View Post

"( Scottie B, the founder of Angry DJ T-Shirts, says he’s the UK’s #1 DJ and he made a T-Shirt about it so you have to assume maybe he’s getting requests too and he’s #1! )"


never heard of him

Neither.

I thought the article was a pretty good read though.

A lot of people are fired up by the debate, but at the end of the day, does it really matter?
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I would hardly call the article as well constructed or insightful... possibly "nuvoDJ states bleeding obvious"
step on my cubes.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Damionpell View Post

It is refreshing to read a well written and constructed view of digital vs vinyl vs old skool vs new skool DJ's

http://behindthedecks.org/2011/07/13...dont-be-angry/

cool site - thanks for the link
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should i made a purchase?? lol there 45 bucks i would rather just tell people what i am thinking and save the money
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Bracko View Post

I would hardly call the article as well constructed or insightful... possibly "nuvoDJ states bleeding obvious"

this

abstract electronica and drone. lights off, cans on, freak out...
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yep, gotta agree, nothing insightful about that article at all.
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inciteful perhaps

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Originally Posted by puretrance89 View Post

My muzza's are more tanked up than your muzzas!

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yeah that too.
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meh


the medium isn't the problem


The instant-Dj is the real problem. The instant-DJ and the diminished value of the skillset and the appreciation/attention paid to tracks is what rubs me up the wrong way.


People downloading a bit of software and some MPfrees and them calling themselves a DJ ... that's what's retarded.
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Just a comment on my article
Hi Everyone,
I appreciate the conversation going on about my post. I really just wanted to comment about the anger and frustration I'm seeing it wasn't meant to be a manifesto on Digital vs. Analog. Quite frankly I know I'm stating the obvious but no one else is just more of the same back and forth and angst about it all. I did write a manifesto in the form of a masters thesis on the DJ creative process. You can find it in my bio and hopefully you will find some insights there that are valuable. I've been around for a while and observed our culture falling to pieces over itself and the blog is just snippets of what I am seeing. Anyway thanks again for reading and Damian especially for sharing it. Cheers everyone.
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^ Hi Cristina, I am working through your thesis - an excellent, well considered piece of work. Well done.
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My reasons for posting it, was that is wasn't a mud slinging, name calling, holy than though, one medium over another medium debate. It was clear, calm and gave credits to both mediums and laid it out correctly, that no matter what, isn't it at the end of the day, what you play, not what you use to play?

I started DJing in 1989 and have progressed from turntables, cdj's to now traktor, but I have always cared more about WHAT I play, instead of what I am playing it on, that means I have been able to remain in an industry, love it and continually move forward, especially an industry that is not very forgiving.

I do agree that the younger DJs come in without much practise, x amount on facebook etc etc, but who cares? seriously, I have seen those types come and go for the last 20 years now and they always fall by the wayside or never get booked, taken seriously, slammed by the industry, mess up etc and they leave the industry and then a new set of kids take their place. I have seen it with promoters, clubs, magazines etc. Nothing changes. Stay true to your music, what you believe, create your own core group of people who follow you and don't worry about what other people are doing, worry about what you are doing
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Damionpell View Post

no matter what, isn't it at the end of the day, what you play, not what you use to play?


yes and no


you can't completely discount the tools used in a performance.



Yes, you can still get a great performance out of any instrument or tool etc, no doubt ... but there's reasons some performers prefer a Steinway grand over a Roland electric piano
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At the end of the day the clubbers just want to hear well mixed quality tunes so that they can enjoy themselves. how you do it using what tools are avaliable is up to you. unless you are seeing a DMC Championship who cares? as long as you perform well / sounds great everyones happy

Last edited by travellingpom: 25-Jul-11 at 02:56pm

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Funkedub View Post

meh


the medium isn't the problem


The instant-Dj is the real problem. The instant-DJ and the diminished value of the skillset and the appreciation/attention paid to tracks is what rubs me up the wrong way.


People downloading a bit of software and some MPfrees and them calling themselves a DJ ... that's what's retarded.

Tend to agree with that.

That is what makes my blood boil, more than any other factor.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by travellingpom View Post

At the end of the day the clubbers just want to hear well mixed quality tunes so that they can enjoy themselves. how you do it using what tools are avaliable is up to you. unless you are seeing a DMC Championship who cares? as long as you perform well / sounds great everyones happy

not really... on a per capita basis, "most" clubbers just want to take drugs and score a half decent root.
step on my cubes.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Damionpell View Post

I have always cared more about WHAT I play, instead of what I am playing it on, that means I have been able to remain in an industry, love it and continually move forward, especially an industry that is not very forgiving.

Spot on!
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Bracko View Post

not really... on a per capita basis, "most" clubbers just want to take drugs and score a half decent root.

This is unfortunately the harsh truth in most places, well the more popular clubs at least. I've heard DJ's go from one trainwreck to the next, and the crowd barely noticed. As long as people heard Pitbull rhyming Kodak with Kodak, they were happy
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashthe1 View Post

This is unfortunately the harsh truth in most places, well the more popular clubs at least. I've heard DJ's go from one trainwreck to the next, and the crowd barely noticed. As long as people heard Pitbull rhyming Kodak with Kodak, they were happy

so sad yet so true
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashthe1 View Post

As long as people heard Pitbull rhyming Kodak with Kodak, they were happy

This is true.

I hate life.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by DjDennis View Post

lol watch out some wont like this at all

for me I dont care because its more aimed at club djs than mobile!

Can't believe I missed this... But LOL.

You don't care because iTunes doesn't have DVS compatibility.
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oh thats right you buy from itunes because you think it legal

it aint for commercial use and djing is a commercial venture


so have a nice day
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Ha ha and a year later, you arrive.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by DjDennis View Post

oh thats right you buy from itunes because you think it legal

it aint for commercial use and djing is a commercial venture

What the fuck are you on about?!? You’ve legally purchased the tune, and if you’re DJing in a bar or club, THEY pay the licensing shit so you’re perfectly fine to play them…if you have an ABN and are a mobile DJ, you pay the licensing shit…you’re an idiot
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Quote:

Originally Posted by DjDennis View Post

oh thats right you buy from itunes because you think it legal

it aint for commercial use and djing is a commercial venture


so have a nice day


OH DEAR GOD NO.
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Hey Dennis there is a user on here caller AFROwookie. He could teach you a thing or two about trolling, and probably DJing too. You should PM him now.
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Oh Denny! How we have missed you!
Spoiler:
seriously fuck off.


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Originally Posted by DJBodie View Post

Ha ha and a year later, you arrive.

It's the dementia.
Check it ****s.
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*yawn*
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Couple of things worth remembering here. The reason that people are there and (hopefully) dancing is not necessarily the same reason that you are playing. This is the inherent difference between the undiscerning/uneducated punters who flock to the "mega-cheese" venues to be able to recognise and dance to whatever popular junk happens to be current on the radio as opposed to the discerning clubbers who choose to attend sometimes smaller, apparently less popular venues BECAUSE of the quality of music being played and the consistency of the DJ(s) ability to build a terrific set which takes the audience on an auditory journey. Now granted, you can argue that the punters are both attending these respective types of venues because of the DJ and what he is playing, but again I would like to reiterate that the reason the people are there is not necessarily for the same reason(s) that you are playing! I have to wholeheartedly agree with what Behind The Decks said with regard to "finding your true audience" because different DJ's have different motivations for playing, but the ones who playing for the crowd that provide them with creative gratification are the ones who are winning, not the ones who are playing like a human top 40 hits jukebox.

The whole "press play" DJ syndrome on the other hand is a separate issue. While I agree in principle that it shouldn't matter what tools the DJ is using to achieve a great result, I would still argue that these people that download from itunes etc and do everything from a laptop do not have anywhere the same degree of creativity as the DJ's that developed their skills over several years (due largely to the fact that you HAD to have more creativity in order to manipulate vinyl turntables and cdj's to get their desired result and because there simply weren't the computer programs that did the real work for you back then).
As DamianPell pointed out though, these fly-by-nighters don't tend to last the distance because they lack the required CREATIVITY needed in order to consistently last in the scene.

Do the punters even care? Because, lets face it, this is largely a DJ only debate which the general public are largely unaware of and moreover, don't really care except in the case of the more discerning (and educated) punters as I pointed out.

These issues (well, issues for the DJ's anyway) are probably never really going to go away, and besides, do they even really matter if you don't let them? Let your DJing speak for itself. Find your true audience and get on with good DJing instead of getting distracted by bullshit debates!

Peace out!
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lol kiwi hasnt read the policies of itunes has he - NO lol he better cos thats one way of getting himself in deep crap when he gets audited one day lol

oh thats right he is the master he wont get caught

Quote:

USAGE RULES

(i) You shall be authorized to use iTunes Products only for personal, noncommercial use.

www.apple.com/legal/itunes/us/terms.html

lol have a nice day
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you know Dennis ... it's strange, but despite the fact there's 100s of DJs out there playing tunes purchased from iTunes and its ilk, that we hardly ever (if ever) hear about their music being audited and subsequently getting fined.

In essence that's probably why everyone thinks you're a joke.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by DjDennis View Post

lol kiwi hasnt read the policies of itunes has he - NO lol he better cos thats one way of getting himself in deep crap when he gets audited one day lol

oh thats right he is the master he wont get caught

USAGE RULES

(i) You shall be authorized to use iTunes Products only for personal, noncommercial use.

www.apple.com/legal/itunes/us/terms.html

lol have a nice day

Yes yes, congrats, you can read, dickhead...but you're still wrong...even buying a fucking CD, you're not licensed to play it commercially, but when you playing in a venue, the venue pays APRA licensing fees for broadcasting music, thus you are covered by them...regardless of the musically format, CD, MP3, Vinyl or otherwise, it's all the same...if you're a mobile hack cock sucking mothering fucking self important wannabe-real-Deejay moron, like yourself, you have to get your own license...it doesn't matter where the music came from, you're never automatically licensed to broadcast it just because you own it the MP3/CD/Record, you need a license/pay fees to APRA in order to be covered.

For someone who acts like he knows everything, you sure don't know jack from shit

And besides, I don't fucking buy tunes to DJ with from iTunes, heck, I prefer not to even buy anything from iTunes are all, fuck Apple, fuck them right in the eye
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**yawn**
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Complaints can be made directly to Dennis here : http://www.djapproved.com/complaints...ation=WA141963

Please ... please ensure it is a VALID complaint though!!
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Yes, your pressence is very fucking tiring, you don't know shit and you keep coming here spouting shit like you do...kindly piss off
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Quote:

Originally Posted by DjDennis View Post

lol kiwi hasnt read the policies of itunes has he - NO lol he better cos thats one way of getting himself in deep crap when he gets audited one day lol

oh thats right he is the master he wont get caught



www.apple.com/legal/itunes/us/terms.html

lol have a nice day

I'm not sure you have any idea how this works.

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dj dennis, why do you bother coming on these forums? seriously?
you have an opinion on everything, and the second someone questions your opinion, you react like you are the all knowing god of everything, and everyone else is wrong. And then you wonder why noone takes you seriously, and finds you irritating.

you can have an opinion on things thats fine. but you are not as knowledgable on the world of djing and dance music, as you like to think you are. If you cant accept that people are going to disagree with you, then dont come on here. period.

you are completely wrong about the use of music in a club environment, because venues that "dj like us play in " pay to have an entertainment license which includes regulations from APRA.

mobile djs have their own license. but "performer djs" which is what most djs here fall under, dont get audited. we dont need a license. clubs do.
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Last edited by special ed: 10-Sep-12 at 04:19pm

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ya'll are being trolled by Dennis ... don't feed the troll. Us the complaint link/procedure i outlined above ...
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Quote:

Originally Posted by DjDennis View Post

oh thats right you buy from itunes because you think it legal

it aint for commercial use and djing is a commercial venture


so have a nice day

Yeah well where do you buy your top40 music Dennis?
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Quote:

Originally Posted by special ed View Post

but "performer djs" which is what most djs here fall under, dont get audited. we dont need a license. clubs do.

I think we can get audited, can't we? But more as a "prove you bought these tracks, not pirated them" kinda way, not a "show me a license to be playing these songs" kinda way

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https://soundcloud.com/random_kiwi/deep-and-low
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not in Australia, in the UK i think they do. Here clubs hold an entertainment license, they are responsible for the holding of an APRA license.
as a dj you are 'performing' there and what is suppose to happen is all music (under licence in Australia) that is played by any of the club's "performers" has to be submitted to APRA. What happens though is 90% of music that djs play are imports and not under any australian license. For example if I download a track from Italy off beatport, i am suppose to follow the licensing laws of Italy if thats played in a club. But really, how is that ever going to be policed??
Mobile DJs have there own license, and have to apply through APRA to play music is a public space.
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well the way you guys act is worse than you have ever been - no talent and no manners
(oh that's right you don't work and just dj in your bedrooms all the time)

where I buy from
I buy from where APRA allows me to (and record stores still) plus on their website (that's right you dont do it legally do you)

I follow how the APRA, PPCA and MIPI do their work, because if they want to they will jail when they feel like to for illegal copyright

Special Ed - did I say it was directed at one particular person
see when you guys go off so much it means your all running scared
oh and if you download from italy you still have to follow Australian Laws as it being played in Australia not in Italy
this is where you need to read the mipi website on how to be legal (but thats to hard for your brain)

oh now random kiwi
i just pointed out something you think you know and do not read and which is true - has nothing to do with licenses etc
anytime your making money in a job (day, night etc) that is a commercial venture by law
so buying from iTunes to play in a club is illegal, because you are replaying it in a commercial establishment NOT at HOME (personal use)
ask a copyright lawyer then (oh thats right you cant)
oh and yes you can get Audited anytime they want to - not up to you its up to them checking if your doing the right thing


and seems others are jealous because they cant get approval from anywhere to state how real they are as a Dj
- oh that's right they still use their bedrooms to dj in - hope mum has her headphones on lol

so who is going to follow what the law actually says on the mipi site
do you all have your ABN numbers for GST ?
do you have the PPCA, APRA, ARIA licenses ?

oh well while you all scurry away and work on being legal I have work to do

have a nice day
DjDennis

CEO - Director/Manager/Entertainment Director
(In this crazy business for over 38+ years)

new updated urls
http://www.trebleclefdj.com.au Main Site!
http://verifydj.trebleclefdj.com.au
http://www.djdennis.com.au
CircusMidget +

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in 2004 DjDennis was arrested after he was spotted mixing children songs for a charity for which he had registered using his website.



Dennis had been playing them without a legally mandated permit and police approval.
DjDennis +

bloody work again - it never ends

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gee looks more like you hahahahaha


oh and on the musicrights site

Quote:

Can I download music from the internet and play it at a function?

The basic principle is that you cannot copy or distribute music including from the internet without the permission of all relevant copyright owners. There are a number of legitimate download sites in Australia which you can find at www.pro-music.org.

If you legitimately buy music from iTunes or other legitimate online distributors, you should check their relevant terms and conditions to make sure that you are licensed for the appropriate purpose, including for use at a function.

What if I download music to use at my function or in my function centre from a site overseas where the law might be different?
Internet activities of this sort typically involve acts of copying, transmission, or distribution in both the ‘receiving and sending’ countries and laws of each will apply. Be aware that if you download music files to your PC located in Australia, without the copyright owners' permission, you are committing an infringement of copyright under Australian law.

Do I need any licences to play legitimately purchased music at my function?
Yes, if your function is being held at a commercial premises (such as a function centre or hotel) then you will need to ensure that the owner of the premises holds a public performance licence to play protected sound recordings from PPCA (or the relevant copyright owner) and a public performance licence to play the musical and literary works from APRA. If you are holding your function at your home, this is considered to be a private function and therefore you do not need to obtain public performance licences.

I operate a function centre. Can I be held responsible for any illegally obtained music played on the premises?
Yes, as the venue operator you may be held liable for authorising copyright infringement if pirated music is played on your premises. This might include iPods that are loaded with illegally downloaded music or DJs who are using digital music devices, such as computers, without the relevant reproduction licences in place. As the venue operator, it is also your responsibility to obtain public performance licences from APRA and PPCA (or the relevant copyright owner).

What are the consequences?
You can be fined up to $60,500 and up to 5 years imprisonment for each offence. For companies the fines are up to 5 times as much. Police can also issue an on-the-spot fine of $1320 and seize illegitimate music product.

oh thats right you know it all LOL
DjDennis

CEO - Director/Manager/Entertainment Director
(In this crazy business for over 38+ years)

new updated urls
http://www.trebleclefdj.com.au Main Site!
http://verifydj.trebleclefdj.com.au
http://www.djdennis.com.au

Last edited by DjDennis: 11-Sep-12 at 07:45pm

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let me just iterate the stupidity of dj dennis:

Quote:

Originally Posted by DjDennis View Post

oh thats right you buy from itunes because you think it legal

it aint for commercial use and djing is a commercial venture


so have a nice day

Quote:

Originally Posted by DjDennis View Post

gee looks more like you hahahahaha
oh and on the musicrights site

[.. site quoted - http://www.pro-music.org/ ..]


oh thats right you know it all LOL

http://www.pro-music.org/Content/Get...ustralasia.php



bottom line: dj dennis is a fucking moron and perhaps the only reason he still posts here is because this forum has no real mod.
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DjDennis +

bloody work again - it never ends

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oh so they changed it - good for you but has itunes allowed it to be used for a commercial venture
thats where its a black area but hey wait and see when you go to court and fight it out lol

no skin of my nose

have a nice day
DjDennis

CEO - Director/Manager/Entertainment Director
(In this crazy business for over 38+ years)

new updated urls
http://www.trebleclefdj.com.au Main Site!
http://verifydj.trebleclefdj.com.au
http://www.djdennis.com.au
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