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TO: whomever writes the ITM articles
You know who you are. Just shut the fuck up already about the death of the scene.

Dubstep: killing the scene

Ableton: killing the scene

USA: killing the scene

SHM just press play: killing the scene

Deadmau5 mouthing off about how everyone is killing the scene.


Seriously, what the fuck happened? so much goddam butthurt. I rarely hear anything positive about dance music on this website anymore, just about how it's no longer underground and "how upset us old skoolers are". Endlessly recycled articles about avicii and SHM and Tiesto and deadmau5 and Guetta and Hawtin and Sven the rest of the big guns and how much goddam money they make. Every single brainfart they decide to upload on twitter seems to constitute a feature article.

To add insult to injury, the occasional times you secure an interview with a half-credible artist, the line of questioning seems to tend towards asking how shit the artist thinks everything is. Way to go guys.

And why the fuck are there more articles on ITM about Paris Hilton than Gessafelstein? How can Justin Bieber feature more regularly these days than Sandwell District? Reaky, Jichael Mackson, Sensorama, Unabombers, the list is endless... these artists should be creating the bulk of your articles, not some fucking poptart hacks trying to broaden their brand (which you are all helping facilitate)

And why are there endlessly recycled articles about how genres have eaten themselves rather than exploring the phoenix rising from the ashes of these implosions? Can you guys actually find some REAL dance music related news? How about using your position to educate the masses? I found out about Madeon today after a very cluey Bede posted that awesome clip in general..... ITM has the positioning to be able to do this shit on a daily basis. Instead, it looks like the entertainment section of the Herald Sun.

Sure you article writers have seen the comments under these "articles"... NO ONE GIVES A FUCK

Shape up, ITM, you were the be all and end all of the Oz dance music scene. Now you are its worst enemy. fix it. now.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Weinertron View Post

You know who you are. Just shut the fuck up already about the death of the scene.

Dubstep: killing the scene

Ableton: killing the scene

USA: killing the scene

SHM just press play: killing the scene

Deadmau5 mouthing off about how everyone is killing the scene.


Seriously, what the fuck happened? so much goddam butthurt.

I thought I was the only one.

Marry me?

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Originally Posted by B_e_de View Post

It's the same as going out on a busy street and looking at the people around you, most of them are fgts.

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this sounds like a negative thread to me
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Quote:

Originally Posted by mlirosi View Post

this sounds like a negative thread to me

Be that as it may, hopefully the outcome is positive.... More relevant articles. (relevant to the dance music community, anyway)
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Uhh, dude, a year ago...

http://www.inthemix.com.au/videos/50...deon_in_action
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I would love to see more positive articles, but numbers dont lie.



Im sure the majority of ITMs traffic (and the ones their advertisers are looking for) most likely never visit these forums.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Weinertron View Post

Be that as it may, hopefully the outcome is positive.... More relevant articles. (relevant to the dance music community, anyway)

I agree whole heartedly, i have often thought that TMZ will preview ITM pages for their next headline

I think that ITM users are just as much to blame...as the comment count on a david guetta article is often higher than a carl craig article

I made the comment on the article about Swedish house mafia breaking up. it was sad that there were so many comments on this article when danny tenaglia announced his retirement only a few months before that and it didnt get half the attention of the swedes

ITM will only report on what the majority want to read...ITM community need to change their habits
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Expletive removed and grammar corrected....


you're welcome.

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Originally Posted by Tristan View Post

well done sofu, perhaps your most offensive post yet!

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Bracko View Post

Expletive removed and grammar corrected....


you're welcome.

Didn't put a capital Y in there mate
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Quote:

Originally Posted by mlirosi View Post

this sounds like a negative thread to me

incorrect compadre, this is where we lay into itm head office


I totally agree with OP, how about a bit of exploratory and creative journalism about good music that needs some more exposure. pull your fingers out
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here here OP.
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contrary to what you may think ITM forum members make up a very small percentage of the entire ITM traffic.

advertising pays for this website to even exist, ITM has to target to a market that is beneficial to advertisers (but not solely)

mlirosi kinda hit nail on head

but really, its hardly a first world problem having a laugh at an article about paris hilton djing
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Quote:

Originally Posted by special ed View Post


but really, its hardly a first world problem having a laugh at an article about paris hilton djing

I'm not laughing at the article, I'm laughing at the person who writes it because usually the articles seem more like a bunch of copy past and a link than anything insightful into the subject matter.

It's a shame its ended up where we are currently at. I understand they need to pay the bills but if they could show a bit more of a penchant towards the more obscure/underground scene/news, even a slight increase, it would be super.

The joke that is the news/articles is most evident by ITM thinking an article about some stooges 60yr old dad hitting up Ibiza is worthy of an article. What the fuck.
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easy solution. submit an article yourself, see if they'll publish it?
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mlirosi does have a nail/head point... it is all click bait and does pay the bills... maybe there should be some form of segregation between tripe reporting and actual investigative reporting? I dunno. Surely there is a way to placate the masses whilst catering to the die-hard EDM fans?

It's just a shame that all the crap articles seem to be the ones which are plugged the most. I rarely actually go to the front page of ITM as I'm generally surfing the forums, so if there are any relevant articles, they usually slip by my attention as there is simply not enough emphasis placed on them.

Special ed, I am very aware that us forumers are certainly in the minority... so maybe there should be some way to tailor the news feed that we get in that little side bar in our forums. you know, fill out a small form about your preferences in music, city, scene, etc.. and then target the relevant articles to those people? I assume this would require some form of ITM 4.3 update, but certainly something that should be considered in the future.

Thanks for the censure Bracko. My years at TAFE have bestowed me with a sailors mouth and requires some reining in every now and again.


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And here I was thinking it was all these murders on the dancefloor that was killing dance music.
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Hey guys, as the Editor of inthemix, I appreciate the feedback (really!), and there's always room for improvement. Naturally I'm going to be the one to think that this thread doesn't take in the full picture of what we do, though. Some of the features that are being identified as 'butthurt' are aimed to be a more nuanced look at some big-picture dance music topics, rather than an 'all is well' assessment, and I think that it's never a one-sided argument that's presented.

In my stint as Editor, I feel like I've channeled a lot into things like the Looking Local features, which is profiles on local crews, parties, artists, etc.

http://www.inthemix.com.au/allabout/.../Looking_Local

Of course there can always be more, and it's something I acknowledge. But to say that inthemix is all about Paris Hilton stories and negativity I think isn't true. But then I would say that.

Weinertron, you mention covering real dance music artists. I think our Honour Roll series to pick one example is all about celebrating people, not negativity - there's extended interviews with Derrick May, Jeff Mills and so on. 2012 has seen features/interviews on Guy J, Trentemoller, DJ Koze, Space Dimension Controller, John Talabot, etc. And it's not like these don't get read by people, so it's not as if users ONLY read the more 'flippant' (or what you might call them!) stories. It's a mix. As for interviews with the big players of the scene, well, they have fans & followings too.

Zodiac, I'm sorry you didn't like the Dad story. It was a bit of fun. Lots of people did seem to get a chuckle out of it. Horses for courses.
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And what do you have to say about the David Guetta phone hacking scandal?


Give the guy a break, he is always happy...smiling with his arms in the air....always...always and forever.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Zodiac View Post

If they could show a bit more of a penchant towards the more obscure/underground scene/news, even a slight increase, it would be super. What the fuck.

There's always room for that, and again, appreciate the feedback. I think given the many articles that go up in the week, this thread does ignore some of the stuff between the 'Most Popular'-level articles. It's easy to go to that tab and sum it all up there. But naturally I feel personally invested in championing that side of things given that I'm as passionate about it as the rest of you (yah, really) - so yes, always room to bulk it up.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by B_e_de View Post

It's the same as going out on a busy street and looking at the people around you, most of them are fgts.

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tbh the story about jersey shore's 'the situation' touring was unforgivable jack, sorry.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by special ed View Post

tbh the story about jersey shore's 'the situation' touring was unforgivable jack, sorry.

Pity! From my 3247 articles so far, that's my favourite
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I don't think the forum community realises it, but it can be impossible to win with you guys. For every article that JackT writes supporting underground talent (of which there are plenty, and they're very well researched and written too), they're all instantly forgotten when there's an interview with the likes of David Guetta or Skrillex, who are both artists who are just as important to the scene in the grand scheme of things, and have had a huge impact, whether you personally enjoy their music or not.

And in terms of the editorial being "negative" - I call bullshit on that. JackT's tone as an editor is about as balanced and measured as you can get, and I don't think the dance community could ask for anymore than the excellence of what he offers. There's a perfect balance of humour and genuine insight, as well as a passion for dance music that shines through in his work.

It is ITM's role to discuss issues and challenges that are faced by the scene, in a measured and objective fashion. And these are also issues that forum posters are discussing themselves, both in the comments field and the forum itself.

For instance, whether the commercialisation of dance music is having a negative effect is a serious topic, which needs to be discussed and reflected upon - and it already IS being discussed both across ITM, as well as well beyond this website, extensively around the rest of the world.

Personally, do I believe that commercialisation is having a negative impact on the scene? No, I most definitely do not, but since so many people around the world believe the opposite, it means that it is a topic that deserves to be discussed. I wrote an article for ITM myself recently called "Is America killing dance music?", and beyond a headline that asked a very provocative question, I wrote it in the hope of offering a balanced and measured discussion of some of the opinions that are being expressed at the moment (by the likes of the 'Wall Street Journal' of all places, among many other important stakeholders in the dance music community). The approach obviously struck a chord, because it ended up being read very extensively around the world.

If you don't want a serious approach to the music that you love so much, then what do you want? The ITM community is lucky to have an editor like JackT who has so much integrity, skill and passion in what he does. You cannot argue with the quality of the editorial that he produces, he is always open to feedback, but personally I don't think the complaints expressed in this thread are valid or called for.

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To be honest i think ITM have picked up their game tenfold with what they cover these days, whilst there are a hell of a lot of stories that blatantly appeal to the masses and pull in the advertising revenue that they need to stay operational. I do see Jack trying his best to balance it with a lot of more serious editorial.

ITM certainly isnt going to please everyone all the time, but if they dont cover the junk (paris hilton / SHM / david chedder) then they will struggle to be able to effectively cover the local scene in the future.

I think some of the looking local / honor roll articles they've run in recent months have been ace.

Still a long way for ITM to go, but at least they are trying.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by pomrocks View Post

Still a long way for ITM to go, but at least they are trying.

Whether you realise it or not, it is hugely presumptuous (and naive) for you to think that you know what ITM's ideal approach should actually be. I'd also assume it'd be fairly frustrating for ITM to hear people like yourself who assume they have an authoritative understand of what the site should be covering.

Whether you realise it or not, JackT has a much wider and authoritative understanding of the dance scene, and the bigger picture across all its different subcultures, that goes well beyond the niche that you work in and are so passionate about. ITM is there to serve every corner of the dance scene, and not just a particular niche, and this is something that many people have a lot of trouble understanding. So hence, JackT us always going to be a better judge of what ITM should be covering.

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Ummm angy, that's exactly what i just said.........actually i think i said that Jacks doing a great job.



There's never going to be perfect balance in most peoples eyes, mine included, but i think ITM are trying pretty hard (and doing quite well) in covering most genres / niches...


Why you always got to try and find something bad in what i say? its like you dont even read my posts & just go on the attack
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Those articles the OP mentioned are all the the 'most populat' section. So it seems ITm are just giving the ppl what thye want.

Same as nine msn. Site is full of shite videos but I'm sure they journalists there would rather write decent stories but its not what the brain dead want.

Ive read some great articles about local scene etc but you have to dig for it. Same as anything worthwhile
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Quote:

Originally Posted by angy View Post

I don't think the forum community realises it, but it can be impossible to win with you guys. For every article that JackT writes supporting underground talent (of which there are plenty, and they're very well researched and written too), they're all instantly forgotten when there's an interview with the likes of David Guetta or Skrillex, who are both artists who are just as important to the scene in the grand scheme of things, and have had a huge impact, whether you personally enjoy their music or not.

And in terms of the editorial being "negative" - I call bullshit on that. JackT's tone as an editor is about as balanced and measured as you can get, and I don't think the dance community could ask for anymore than the excellence of what he offers. There's a perfect balance of humour and genuine insight, as well as a passion for dance music that shines through in his work.

It is ITM's role to discuss issues and challenges that are faced by the scene, in a measured and objective fashion. And these are also issues that forum posters are discussing themselves, both in the comments field and the forum itself.

For instance, whether the commercialisation of dance music is having a negative effect is a serious topic, which needs to be discussed and reflected upon - and it already IS being discussed both across ITM, as well as well beyond this website, extensively around the rest of the world.

Personally, do I believe that commercialisation is having a negative impact on the scene? No, I most definitely do not, but since so many people around the world believe the opposite, it means that it is a topic that deserves to be discussed. I wrote an article for ITM myself recently called "Is America killing dance music?", and beyond a headline that asked a very provocative question, I wrote it in the hope of offering a balanced and measured discussion of some of the opinions that are being expressed at the moment (by the likes of the 'Wall Street Journal' of all places, among many other important stakeholders in the dance music community). The approach obviously struck a chord, because it ended up being read very extensively around the world.

If you don't want a serious approach to the music that you love so much, then what do you want? The ITM community is lucky to have an editor like JackT who has so much integrity, skill and passion in what he does. You cannot argue with the quality of the editorial that he produces, he is always open to feedback, but personally I don't think the complaints expressed in this thread are valid or called for.

u mad bro?

Seriously though I think he's doing a pretty good job.

There is just a little bit too much of this 'XX killing the scence' butthurt going around at the moment. First it was Tiesto. Then Electro House. Then Guetta. Then Brostep. Then the SHM. Then the underground committing haki-kari.

Why is the scene always dying? Shouldn't it be dead by now?

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It's the same as going out on a busy street and looking at the people around you, most of them are fgts.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by pomrocks View Post

Why you always got to try and find something bad in what i say?

Because there is sometimes a very condescending tone in what you write, Dave! It can be a little inappropriate, and you should think a little bit more before you hit reply. I am trying to illustrate to you that there is a bigger picture beyond your own unique (and wonderful) subculture, and it's perfectly understandable that punters and promoters forget this sometimes - but there are a countless number of different subcultures within dance music that need to have their voice heard. ITM is one of the broadest sites in the world in terms of catering to them, as far as the different specialist sites that I regularly read.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by YossarianIsSane View Post

There is just a little bit too much of this 'XX killing the scence' butthurt going around at the moment. First it was Tiesto. Then Electro House. Then Guetta. Then Brostep. Then the SHM. Then the underground committing haki-kari.

Why is the scene always dying? Shouldn't it be dead by now?

Right there with ya bro, it's what I've been saying (and arguing about on the forums) for years haha

But it's the enthusiasts themselves (and some of the important DJs and artists) who are making these claims. So naturally, if these conflicts of opinion continue to exist, then dance music media will end up returning to the subject.

Personally, I reckon America's embrace of 'EDM' will in the end be the best thing that ever happened to the underground - but the artists do definitely need to be conscious of the creative compromises they might be making when chasing mass appeal (these are just a few thoughts on the topic). But the scene definitely aint dying

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Quote:

Originally Posted by angy View Post

Because there is sometimes a very condescending tone in what you write, Dave! It can be a little inappropriate, and you should think a little bit more before you hit reply. I am trying to illustrate to you that there is a bigger picture beyond your own unique (and wonderful) subculture, and it's perfectly understandable that punters and promoters forget this sometimes - but there are a countless number of different subcultures within dance music that need to have their voice heard. ITM is one of the broadest sites in the world in terms of catering to them, as far as the different specialist sites that I regularly read.

I think you're trying to read things into my posts that aren't there dude....

Unless you're a closet Paris Hilton fan and my junk comment offended you.

Trust me i know and appreciate the fact that without a strong commercial scene what i enjoy and do would not even possibly exist. Doesn't mean i like it, but i sure as hell understand why ITM reports on it.

So stop trying to pick holes when im actually giving people some credit....
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^^Whether it is your intention or not, there's sometimes a condescending tone in your posts. Best just be aware of it for contributing to future healthy and constructive discussions, I say

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Those CDJ things are gonna kill the scene, man
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Balls Deep View Post

Those CDJ things are gonna kill the scene, man

Laptops on stage? No way are we gonna survive this!

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oh angy

my point was jacks doing damn good job covering pretty much every aspect of a pretty wide range of scenes / genres.....and ITM does cover a hell of a lot.....
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^^That's much better, you are clearly learning, and all is right with the world

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Yep, very selective memories here and by the OP

There was a similar bitch thread about 2 years ago before ITM had the massive overhaul. In it everyone chucked around ideas, including me that suggested the in depth look into local parties which ITM subsequently began to do.

JackT also does a very good job and I can pretty much always pick an article by him without looking at the byline because he writes in a positive way about interesting shit and there's usually a few laughs involved. Cursory glance of the ITM features section shows a lot of good work being done.

Also, how can I submit a feature? Can I PM them to you JackT?
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Also, why do the forums keep being called a 'minority'?

As far as I can see the viewcounts of threads are double/triple of the most read articles. Accounting multiple views from mobile devices, there's still a shitload more views.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by YossarianIsSane View Post

u mad bro?

Seriously though I think he's doing a pretty good job.

There is just a little bit too much of this 'XX killing the scence' butthurt going around at the moment. First it was Tiesto. Then Electro House. Then Guetta. Then Brostep. Then the SHM. Then the underground committing haki-kari.

Why is the scene always dying? Shouldn't it be dead by now?

Just one thing on this, what I would say on this is that I don't think any discussion feature we've published has concluded that anything is "killing" the scene. There's always multiple viewpoints put forward. That could be a perception from headlines, or just a vibe, but I don't think ITM raises the death-knell for anything.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by YossarianIsSane View Post

There is just a little bit too much of this 'XX killing the scence' butthurt going around at the moment.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hbomb203 View Post

Sausages make everything better astro. FACT.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jameszabiela

I have to disagree with regards to the sausages...

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ITM 4 LYF

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@Zodiac, did you seriously not enjoy Jack's Dad's Ibiza review? WHAT

Anyway, I don't think there can be any disputing what an amazing job Jack does with ITM. He makes a concerted effort to cover the local scene, emerging producers and talented lesser-known guys, even when it's not going to rake in the page views. It'd be pretty silly to single out a few for-the-lols articles about Paris Hilton as being indicative of the site's demise. As others have said, ITM covers a broad range of genres and interests and naturally, not everyone is going to be interested in every article we publish.

In conclusion, three cheers for JackT!
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Hip hip....
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OH YES OH YES MELBOURNE!!

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Quote:

Originally Posted by YossarianIsSane View Post

Last week, I did 3 shits in a single day.

i do 3-4 shits every day.

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnbiggs View Post

right on **** sign me up

dj name: big facotr
style: ballbag disco
promotion ability: zilch none naada
stage presence: fuck it **** im on the d floor and use a long stick from there to change the faders.

Weinertron +

random shoutbox generator

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JackT, thanks for your honest response. It's good to have an editor that cares.

I have a pretty easy solution which may actually placate many of us (admittedly) bitchy forumers. It's pretty clear that the bulk of the clickbait (paris, justin, SHM et al) are to pay the bills. I can accept this. Unfortunately as a forumer, these are the only new articles that pop up in my feed and it give the illusion of pop saturation. I seem to recall that particular bar actually updated with recently released articles, and now that has seemed to change to "Most Popular" articles. (was this actually the case? or am I going crazy?)

It doesn't take a genius here to work out there is some kind of incongruence. It's pretty obvious that the people who hang out on the forums really DON'T care about what's popular. So why would you expose them to it all the time? I reckon switch back to the "Latest News" format. That would at least give me (us?) more of an insight as to your writer's ACTUAL output, rather than your bill-paying output. And if you can add some kind of optional filter to edit out any stuff that comes from Sydney, involves paris hilton, involves Deadmau5 not shutting the fuck up, I'd be all for it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by angy

But it's the enthusiasts themselves (and some of the important DJs and artists) who are making these claims. So naturally, if these conflicts of opinion continue to exist, then dance music media will end up returning to the subject.

This is certainly true to a certain extent, but there is a fine line between reporting the actual issues, and just being a mouthpiece for some pissed off DJ. Sometimes it's best to ignore the idiots and their comments (regardless of their influence in the scene). sometimes people just need to shut the fuck up, and by reporting their every thought you are giving a voice to someone who would usually just say this kinda stuff to his friends. Honestly, I know I keep picking on Deadmau5 (cos he's the most obvious culprit) but I really do not care what he thinks about most things and I doubt many people do (mainly cos he's an utter fuckwit). And those that REALLY want to know what he thinks can subscribe to twitter. Because that's what many of the articles are: just a regurgitation of a twitter post (which is pretty lazy stuff imo). I went drinking last night so I'm having trouble trying to think of more examples (DJ Sneak is one of em), but they are certainly there.

Thanks angy and JackT for contributing. For the record, I fucking love ITM and the community. I know since I've started coming here that it's changed a lot (the nature of the beast it seems) but still one of my fave websites. We could all use a bit of tweaking every now and again.


In fact, I'm going to go tweak myself right now




NB: I HAVE been enjoying the honour rolls. They are excellent. But sadly, these articles are in the minority. More stuff like this please (although the Derrick May one seemed to be full of butthurt from the man himself... can't win em all I guess)
Fuck Everything Forever

Last edited by Weinertron: 28-Jun-12 at 07:58am

Reason: I have my reasons

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